For Safety's Sake.....

[True Grip]

I didn't think anybody was being to hard on the rider and there seems to be plenty of information. The cameraman is set up on curve called brake or bust and recorded it.If you are an aggressive woods rider you know what it's like to smack a tree. You MXers know what it's like to miss a jump. If you chased speed on the track for very long u know what a low side feels like and the value of good leathers. Maybe the lesson here is there is little margin for error when riding on the edge of limits weather it's our own or our equipment.

 

[Dallara]

~


Lots and lots of "Monday Morning Quaterbacking" here... And from what the rider himself says lots of erroneous conjecture. Just read for yourself:


http://www.advrider.com/forums/showpost.php?p=21321172&postcount=17419

"I was lightly on the throttle through the corner, no chopping the throttle or braking... I had not time to panic or input any controls... Went from a normal hard corner to sliding on metal/asphalt in an instant."


He wasn't trying to "race/win" anything... He wasn't treating the Dragon like a "race track" or his mount like a "road race bike"... From Mike's posts over the years on ADVrider it's doubtful he was "over driving (his) skills"... It's also fairly apparent he didn't enter "this turn all wrong" nor was it a case of him "out riding his ability to corner properly"... Nor was it necessarily "bad body positioning", his closing the throttle, or his "coming in too hot", treating his Super Tenere "like a sport bike", etc., etc., etc. as he has been so blatantly accused of in another thread about the crash. I would hazard to guess Mike has more riding experience than many who are criticizing his technique so vigorously... One thing's for sure - until you are in exactly the same corner, under exactly the same circumstances and conditions, etc. then there is simply no possible way anyone knows whether they would have done any better, or worse for that matter.

It's hard enough to determine the exact cause of a crash if you're standing right there watching it unfold, and nigh onto impossible to accurately do so based on nothing more than a very few photographs. Maybe it's time to give Mike a break, and the benefit of the doubt... Well, that is unless those of you basically suggesting he didn't know what he was doing never make any mistakes yourselves.

And you might want to take a look at his ADVrider profile, too: http://www.advrider.com/forums/member.php?u=88690

Dallara



~

 

[Firefight911]

And you might want to take a look at his ADVrider profile, too: http://www.advrider.com/forums/member.php?u=88690

Dallara



~

Crap, he sells flooring!

 

[scott123007]

I wonder if a measurement of the "width" of the various skid plates should be added for cases like this...

On this thread of course---- http://www.yamahasupertenere.com/index.php?topic=4999.0

 

[thfraser]

There are going to be at least 3 different skid plates at the Romney event this weekend. I have a tape measure, so we could try and get some measurements. This is a good point.

 

[avc8130]

There are going to be at least 3 different skid plates at the Romney event this weekend. I have a tape measure, so we could try and get some measurements. This is a good point.

Oh perfect, kick them all over and see what touches first O

ac

 

[Obrianmcc]

IMO images 6-8 confirm plate contact... Also noticed how much higher his footpegs appear to be in relation to the bottom of the slid plate.

I doubt the rider is at any fault here.... the frame work of the skid plate, which is neccessary for the type of protection this system provides, decreases ground clearance just enough that when the stars aligned for this rider he found out the hard way the performace limit of his setup.

Sucks that the bike was totaled?

 

[Firefight911]

I doubt the rider is at any fault here....

I don't even know where to begin. ???

 

[Dallara]

I don't even know where to begin. ???

Oh, please... Do tell. :

Dallara



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[roy]

I don't even know where to begin. ???

::008::

 

[limey]

I don't even know where to begin. ???

::017::

 

[clint64]

I agree that the Dragon is a road best ridden mid week. Was up there last Friday and stopped in the store to look around. Was pretty crowded and the nut factor seemed pretty high so went down Hwy 28 south from the store to continue the ride. Apart from the nuts, the Dragon does have a lot of curves that are off camber with elevation changes thrown in also. This coupled with the photographer factor makes this a perfect place to have a get off. I am glad to see that Mike is unhurt.

 

[snakebitten]

I read Mikes Blog. Good guy. Extremely straightforward. (equates to honest)

He says his foot peg touches down before the Rumbux or the boxes do. (although barely before)

Having said that, and with the risk of putting words in his mouth, I think Mike would say that knowing what he knows now, he could repeat the ride without the get-off. In other words, he will have learned from his error.

And, in fact, he wants ALL of us to learn from his error. (specifically us that ride Teneres with big boxes and Rumbux crash bars)

That, He said so himself.

"Lesson learned" requires subject matter and some form of miscalculation to teach about. I don't think Mike is hiding behind Rumbux. Nor blaming them.

 

[88millimeter]

Well said snake, but can we agree that the purchaser of a product should be made aware of the risks? Honestly, this crash scenario never even crossed my mind. A distributor of the rumbux posted that he will make buyers aware of this remote possibilty which i think is great. At that point it's up to the purchaser to consider the risks involved.

 

[avc8130]

I don't even know where to begin. ???

Welcome to America. Let the lawyers sort it out.

ac

 

[tc9988]

I don't even know where to begin. ???

How about by saying nothing for a change, unless of course you are an accident reconstruction professional who can determine the cause of the accident from 2000 miles away based on 23 still photographs

 

[snakebitten]

Well said snake, but can we agree that the purchaser of a product should be made aware of the risks? Honestly, this crash scenario never even crossed my mind. A distributor of the rumbux posted that he will make buyers aware of this remote possibilty which i think is great. At that point it's up to the purchaser to consider the risks involved.

Yes. Absolutely agree that "purchaser" should be aware. I'm a purchaser myself. I can't say that I was oblivious to the reduced "clearances" that are obvious after you hang the Rumbux from the frame. But I freely admit that I didn't define it as accurately as Mike has now. I'm very informed now.

Edited: And to be really honest, It might be MORE than a "remote possibility" for those that haven't been made aware.

 

[Dallara]

How about by saying nothing for a change, unless of course you are an accident reconstruction professional who can determine the EXACT cause of the accident, the rider's skill level, the EXACT road conditions, etc. from 2000 miles away based on 23 still photographs... As well as clearly proving you are a better and more experienced rider who has never made a mistake yourself, and can further positively prove you would not have crashed in the same situation.

::008:: ::008:: ::008:: ::008:: ::008::

And I fixed it a bit for ya'...

Dallara



~

 

[88millimeter]

Yes. Absolutely agree that "purchaser" should be aware. I'm a purchaser myself. I can't say that I was oblivious to the reduced "clearances" that are obvious after you hang the Rumbux from the frame. But I freely admit that I didn't define it as accurately as Mike has now. I'm very informed now.

Edited: And to be really honest, It might be MORE than a "remote possibility" for those that haven't been made aware.

Just to be clear the reduced ground clearances are obvious, no doubt, what wasn't obvious (to me anyways) was the reduced maximum lean angle. Not to mention the fact that there is no give when you touch down a robust frame mounted skid plate versus a spring loaded footpeg designed to fold.

 

[snakebitten]

Just to be clear the reduced ground clearances are obvious, no doubt, what wasn't obvious (to me anyways) was the reduced maximum lean angle. Not to mention the fact that there is no give when you touch down a robust frame mounted skid plate versus a spring loaded footpeg designed to fold.

I hope you don't think I was implying anything derogatory. And thanks for being honest that you hadn't thought about the reduced lean angle. But I did. I actually mentally measured all of the aspects that I could visualize when I bolted the thing on. And was conscious that there were compromises being made. Lots of them, in fact. But this graphical record far surpasses my own mental imagery, and I now know that I have less available lean than I had predicted.

Also, someone else stated that Mike had conveyed that had the Rumbux not hit just barely before the boxes did, we would be talking about the panniers instead. I actually thought my bags were my limiter. And I admit to riding more aggressive when I remove them. Now I know that after removing them, it really hasn't improved my lean clearance at all.

Again. I have learned from this. I am grateful.

Hey Dallara, your post on the other forum concerning this same subject was excellent. I wanted to flat out copywrite infringe to post it here.
Why the different approach over here? Have we worn you out that bad?