Cooked Headlamp Harness

silverthunder

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Headlight (left and right) is a one-piece part (see OEM Catalogue Part).
They told me that Iwata wants my detective part to study the "issue" . They have to understand if the bug is in the connector or in the "system". I think this is good (for us), not stupid!
 

tomatocity

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If Yamaha admits there is a problem with the Connector(s) they would have to issue a Recall or Technical Service Bulletin. This would be very expensive and they would lose face with the quality of what they manufacture.
 

silverthunder

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If "they know" there is an issue they HAVE TO recall.... I agree with you.... I Don't know how many ST are "affected".... Here in italy, in the greatest community forum on ST i've read about 4-5 cases.... Maybe in Japan they have to get informations about this issue
 

Dallara

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tomatocity said:
If Yamaha admits there is a problem with the Connector(s) they would have to issue a Recall or Technical Service Bulletin. This would be very expensive and they would lose face with the quality of what they manufacture.

Perhaps...

But I actually think it would bolster customer confidence if they admit there is a problem and make an effort to correct it. At least it would with me.

And it's what they did with the fuel tank o-ring recall. I don't think that really caused Yamaha to "lose face" with any of us about their machine's quality. At least it didn't with me. YMMV. :)

I should also add that Yamaha did warranty my headlamp harness and give me a new one, free of charge.

Dallara



~
 

silverthunder

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Up in this thread someone hyphotized something about wireless etc.... My knowledge is equal to 0 in electrical issues but I think that many are the potential critical steps
 

creggur

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tomatocity said:
If Yamaha admits there is a problem with the Connector(s) they would have to issue a Recall or Technical Service Bulletin. This would be very expensive and they would lose face with the quality of what they manufacture.
TSBs actually save manufactures money as shops have a ready-reference to perform a warranty repair to address a specific problem instead of 'throwing the kitchen sink' at a problem in the hopes of fixing it. I'd guess if they are replacing headlamp assemblies they are in the 'discovery' phase where they collect data about the affected system so they can determine the proper repair and distribute it to their dealer network via a TSB. Unfortunately, these things take time and they don't want to get the 'fix' wrong as that could really cost them both financially and in their reputation for quality.

And while we Armchair Quarterback this thing to death and complain that we've figured out the problem and a simple solution - Yamaha must ensure that whatever modification they deem necessary to repair the problem will pass DOT and NHTSA muster or they could end up in real trouble. Especially on a critical safety item such as a headlamp on a motorcycle.

If it's anything like the car business - they will start with a TSB - to address the concerns as they occur. If they determine the problem is widespread, they will issue a Campaign where anytime a bike comes into a shop for ANY service the update is performed (likely what most of you are referring to as a Recall). And finally, if they can't get 75% of the VINs they determine to be affected updated in a certain timeframe - they must issue a Safety Recall where all owners are officially notified to bring their vehicles in for update/repair.

Manufactures like to address these concerns as they happen with TSBs because it's the least expensive option. They will launch a Campaign if they fear the problem is widespread enough to warrant a recall or there is potential for a class-action suit. Their least favorite option is the Safety Recall as it is most expensive and the Federal Government is involved...

I'm not defending Yamaha here - I'm just sharing the reality of a situation that I deal with daily as a service manager at a car dealership. It is what it is...
 

Tremor38

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I picked up some contact paste that is used on the worn contacts of headlight connectors on older vehicles. Seems like it's working OK, but will keep an eye on it.

Sent from my F-05D using Tapatalk 2
 

ErnsTT

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Okay its a died down thread, but as i was just curious if more had the problem, i checked and saw there were some more patients.
Why i looked, well i always put my connectors in vaseline since 1985, i'm a winter rider and they use excesive salt here in .NL, and having had numerous backlight failures my trusted Pappie Nolen said to me to check the ground terminal of the XT500 lighthouse lamp, and de-rust it and put some vaseline on it...

I've never had curious electric gremlins but for the connector i forgot because it was hidden behind the Trickers battery, until last week, the left bulb died on me, a few eeks after the right one blew...
Lazy as i am (hence lazymotorbike.eu) i stalled at fixing it, having a functioning righthand light, but yesterday the Left light returned to active service !
That's something i clearly dont like (yes i'nm strange i know it) other people would be delighted in these dire straits, but i don't like elektrics having their own will, so got my reading glasses to look at the connector, having read this thread long ago, and lo and behold, my left connector shows a bit of melt"wiggle" e.g. the surface had a little flat droplet like a bit of superglue on it.
That's the first stage of overheating !

And checking here its the same side of the connector, the black wire (yes its a true XT having Groundplug trouble...), thats curious, why are all the connectors melting on the same side?
It feels like quite a tight fit, had to use quite a bit of pull to get it off, so it could not be to loose a terminal was my first conclusion...

Until i looked closer having put on the reading glasses, if you look closely, you will see abrasive slithers in the headlight cover, and in the hole were the wire leaves the connector, that is really strange i thought.
So had an even closer look with the old lamp in the socket, the terminal isn't held by the brass terminals, but by the plastic socket itself, and if you look at the ground (-) side of teh socket the throngs of the brass connector are not to be seen !

So thats the culprit, a worn out casting orifice at the factory of N-D (or stanley?) causing the connector housing at heat up pushing the lamps throng away from the brass connector springs.

No new loom needed just a bit of blood sweat and vaseline :)

Pinch open your connector housing, two catches at either side AND one in the middle, open the back and slide the brass angled connectors out, and get a little slot(h)file into the orifice and take away the exess plastic, until all parts of the brass connector are easily to be seen when mounted in their place.

Put the brass prongs in contact with the file too, to get the oxidised skin away, and bend them very carefully until the have a snug fit on your new lamp, and use the Vaseline !

Put everything togehter again, and but for the cost of a new lamp and a bit of vaseline you will heve no problem in the forseeable future :)

P.S. as soon as you see the prongs from the bulb coloring, you know you got a bad connector housing, my right side was looking bright yellow brass, but the left side was more like the brown smudgy look of a century old Sax...

Here some pictures from the thread, will post my own tooling somewere in teh future at my own site.





Plastic completely melted at the mentioned spot around the groundconnector.

Here the new housing, with the way to bulky plastic obstructing the lamps prong making adequate contact with the actual brass connector inside, reduce that to 1 mm and the problem is fixed forever...




You dont even see a glimpse of the "B" shaped spings that make the electrical connection, this can be pure a result of the angle at which the foto is taken, but with my connector you could not see the lips of the "B" if looking full frontal...
 

simmons1

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Left headlight went out today. Looks like the harness might be starting to melt. I pulled it off looked at it and put it back on and the headlight came back to life.
 

Tremor38

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Thanks, ErnsTT. My connector bodies haven't degraded as of yet, but I did have one instance of the right bulb going dark until I wiggled the the connector on the terminals. I have two brand new ceramic connectors that I might try..if they accept the OEM teminals. If not, I'll go ahead and remove some of that lip on the OEM connector bodies as you did.
 

simmons1

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simmons1 said:
Left headlight went out today. Looks like the harness might be starting to melt. I pulled it off looked at it and put it back on and the headlight came back to life.
Just went out in the parking lot at work and took a closer look. There is insulation damage to one of the wires where it goes in to the connector on the left side. The right side look good still.
 

jajpko

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simmons1 said:
Just went out in the parking lot at work and took a closer look. There is insulation damage to one of the wires where it goes in to the connector on the left side. The right side look good still.
That's not good.. Did you happen to notice if it was the black wire or blue?
On another note, we'll have to get together and talk about bikes.. Maybe a ride after it cools down..
 

roy

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simmons1 said:
Left headlight went out today. Looks like the harness might be starting to melt. I pulled it off looked at it and put it back on and the headlight came back to life.
Exactly what happened to mine a few weeks back. I had the harness replaced and I have watched the black wire slowly turn gray over the weeks due to heat build up. It is still getting hot in the housing and the wiring loom is very hot to the touch so I fully expect it to melt again. Right side does not seem to get as hot. And since Yamaha blamed my condition on everything from the sun rising in the east to my Denali D2's causing it I can say with my right hand on a bible that my Denali D2's have not been on since the new harnes was installed. I don't ride at night so that is easy for me to live with. I intentionally have not used them to prove this harnes will melt on it's own again. My hand on everything test proved early on that the Denali lights were not the problem. They don't even get warm nor does the wiring or relay down near the battery. The only area getting hot is inside the headlight housing and the Yamaha wiring harness in there.

There is not a problem according to Yamaha just continue to ride with no headlights. NTSB filing is the only way to go at them at this point because no one at Yamaha US is listening trust me.
 

simmons1

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roy said:
I had the harness replaced and I have watched the black wire slowly turn gray over the weeks due to heat build up.
Black wires? I just went out and looked again and both of mine appear to be gray.
 

roy

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simmons1 said:
Black wires? I just went out and looked again and both of mine appear to be gray.
They start out black. I seen my harness brand new.
 

creggur

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roy said:
Exactly what happened to mine a few weeks back. I had the harness replaced and I have watched the black wire slowly turn gray over the weeks due to heat build up. It is still getting hot in the housing and the wiring loom is very hot to the touch so I fully expect it to melt again. Right side does not seem to get as hot. And since Yamaha blamed my condition on everything from the sun rising in the east to my Denali D2's causing it I can say with my right hand on a bible that my Denali D2's have not been on since the new harnes was installed. I don't ride at night so that is easy for me to live with. I intentionally have not used them to prove this harnes will melt on it's own again. My hand on everything test proved early on that the Denali lights were not the problem. They don't even get warm nor does the wiring or relay down near the battery. The only area getting hot is inside the headlight housing and the Yamaha wiring harness in there.

There is not a problem according to Yamaha just continue to ride with no headlights. NTSB filing is the only way to go at them at this point because no one at Yamaha US is listening trust me.
Read my post, Roy. Nothing happens that fast - they must ensure that the fix they come up with is correct, cost-effective as possible, and will pass the test of time. If they under-engineered something, they will fix it. For fuck's sake give them a few minutes to figure it out. There are more variables than you can imagine: Cause of failure; Environment(only an issue in warmer climates?); Proper repair; Cost to repair; Government regulations; and onandonandonandon.

Just because you've experienced an issue that six other people on a forum have doesn't mean they are out to get you... ::002::
 
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