2012 Tenere in the Shop

[Hungry Tiger]

My valve adjust culprit was the exhausts. Dealer mechanic found them ways too tight, ultimately not closing tight, hence no compression. Intake valves were within lower third of ok range, but got adjusted to mid-range. Here's to getting back on the road (without your cough).

 

[roy]

Yamaha US warranty is a joke! I've been saying this all along and none of you will listen until you personally have to deal with them then y'all start to come around.

I personally will never buy a product from them again until they change their attitude towards the customer.

I bought and installed the 14 CCT in my 2012 and after 500 or so miles it's still quiet. It starts rattling again and I'm selling or trading it off. I'm not going back 20 years with technology and adjusting this manually. If I do that I might as well go back to a chain drive carbed motorcycle that cost way less than this thing.

 

[TXTenere]

Yamaha US warranty is a joke! I've been saying this all along and none of you will listen until you personally have to deal with them then y'all start to come around.

I personally will never buy a product from them again until they change their attitude towards the customer.

I bought and installed the 14 CCT in my 2012 and after 500 or so miles it's still quiet. It starts rattling again and I'm selling or trading it off. I'm not going back 20 years with technology and adjusting this manually. If I do that I might as well go back to a chain drive carbed motorcycle that cost way less than this thing.

In my experience, the dealer is as (or more) important to warranty coverage as the warranty policy itself. In other words, if you're happy with the warranty consideration that you've been given, or unhappy with the warranty consideration that you've been given, the dealer may be the one to thank or be upset with. How they submit the warranty claim can really make or break a deal.

Before giving up on Yamaha, consider trying another dealer; preferably one with very positive feedback on the handling of warranty claims.

 

[Checkswrecks]

Says the guy who is all-Suzuki and has said he is about to sell the Yamaha for the last 2 years.
:
It's not that I am not listening, it is that what you contend is absolutely not true for any of my personal experience with four different Yamaha motorcycles, friends motorcycles back to the 1970s, my or friend's outboard motors, or the company reputation. Yamaha has stepped up and paid for more out of warranty stuff than any company I've dealt with, including Suzuki. (This is not a diss on Suzuki, which I once worked for.)

Yamaha US warranty is a joke! I've been saying this all along and none of you will listen until you personally have to deal with them then y'all start to come around.

I personally will never buy a product from them again until they change their attitude towards the customer.

I bought and installed the 14 CCT in my 2012 and after 500 or so miles it's still quiet. It starts rattling again and I'm selling or trading it off. I'm not going back 20 years with technology and adjusting this manually. If I do that I might as well go back to a chain drive carbed motorcycle that cost way less than this thing.

 

[Big Blu]

In my experience, the dealer is as (or more) important to warranty coverage as the warranty policy itself. In other words, if you're happy with the warranty consideration that you've been given, or unhappy with the warranty consideration that you've been given, the dealer may be the one to thank or be upset with. How they submit the warranty claim can really make or break a deal.

Before giving up on Yamaha, consider trying another dealer; preferably one with very positive feedback on the handling of warranty claims.

+1
Well said sir.
And sometimes it comes down to the rider, ya know, the guy who buys all his parts on-line, does his own maintenance, goes into the dealership with a chip on his shoulder and a large attitude....... then expects the dealer to "go the extra mile" for him.

Paul

 

[Tremor38]

Says the guy who is all-Suzuki and has said he is about to sell the Yamaha for the last 2 years.
:
It's not that I am not listening, it is that what you contend is absolutely not true for any of my personal experience with four different Yamaha motorcycles, friends motorcycles back to the 1970s, my or friend's outboard motors, or the company reputation. Yamaha has stepped up and paid for more out of warranty stuff than any company I've dealt with, including Suzuki. (This is not a diss on Suzuki, which I once worked for.)

Mississippi... That's all you gotta gawl durn know.

 

[tomatocity]

Talked with Yamaha today (finally) and they approved the hours to remove the head.

Things I don't understand...
... How can there be compression levels of 167 and 171 (96 is standard) and have a leak down rate of 96% ?
... Extreme carbon buildup in the head. Dealer said the intake valves were not completely closing and causing the high leak down percentage.
... What is causing the extreme carbon buildup?

What causes carbon buildup in cylinder?...
... Un-burnt fuel? Could the ECU be the cause?
... Burnt oil that should not be in the cylinder? If so, where would the oil come from?

Appreciate your help.

 

[EricV]

@Roy - What town/dealer? (I'm moving to Nettleton soon... Amory looks like the nearest Yamaha dealer, though I haven't scoped out Tupelo yet.

@Tomato - I also was told I had odd carbon build up when the CCT issue was being diagnosed. Also that there was something odd about a couple of valves, appeared to not be closing all the way, and half of one piston looked very lean (wtf??) Also had the error code 14, which the Yes Warranty Manager attempted to blame the whole issue on, a bad sensor. Dealer tech said BS, but added it to the parts list and replaced it anyway.

One data point on the carbon build up. I had similar issues with my FJR at around 100k. There were some other causitive factors for problems, but not for the carbon build up. Both bikes had been getting a steady diet of Rotella T-6 + STP oil treatment. I have decided to do a 'test' and only use Yamalube full synthetic for the next 80k miles on the Super Ten and see if I still get 'excess carbon build up'.

 

[jaeger22]

When I pulled the head off mine at 27,825 miles I was shocked at the amount of carbon build up as you can see here:

I have no clue why. It was running fine before I screwed up the valve adjustment. :'( I do a lot of long distance high speed (interstate) travel and also do all my around town commuting on it but I don't know if either has anything to do with it.
Any thoughts?

 

[scott123007]

When I pulled the head off mine at 27,825 miles I was shocked at the amount of carbon build up as you can see here:

I have no clue why. It was running fine before I screwed up the valve adjustment. :'( I do a lot of long distance high speed (interstate) travel and also do all my around town commuting on it but I don't know if either has anything to do with it.
Any thoughts?

Points to ponder,,,

High speed and high RPM can be two different things,,,
High Test has more cleansing additives than Regular,,,
What type of oil is being used,,,

 

[tomatocity]

If I can... I use Chevron Premium gasoline every fill up. Always use Premium gasoline.

Like Fred... I use Yamalube 10w40 and the Yamaha OEM oil filter purchased from the dealer. Change oil every 4,000ish miles. I will change it sooner than later.

EDIT: Added
If it is alright with everyone... I plan to show the Dealer and Yamaha (if needed) this information. Thanks to everyone for sharing your experience(s), pictures, opinions, and thoughts. If you haven't shared, please do.

 

[justlookin]

I dont have a tenere but carbon build up is usually caused by oil. Oil can get into the combustion chamber by either coming past the piston rings or being sucked in passed the (inlet) valve guide. I see from the parts diagram that the tenere has seals on the valve guides, so maybe a bad seals could be the cause.

I guess carbon build up inside the valve guide may prevent the valve closing properly

John
ps experience with oil and carbon comes for riding and fixing old british bikes

 

[tomatocity]

Stopped by the dealer today... They pulled the valve cover and found the Exhaust Cam to be out of time a bunch.

The Bad...
... if the exhaust cam is out of time a bunch then there should be extensive damage similar REM's fiasco.

The Good...
... is the Dealer will be calling Yamaha on Tuesday morning to let them know what they found.

The Discussion...
... looks like another Cam Chain Tensioner failure
... now the wait to find out what repair Yamaha initially will authorize.
... Eric since my case is very similar to yours, can I use your repair information if I have to negotiate with the Dealer, Yamaha, and YES ?
... ???

 

[EricV]

... Eric since my case is very similar to yours, can I use your repair information if I have to negotiate with the Dealer, Yamaha, and YES ?
... ???

No problem, just tell me what you need or print the forum post and show it to your dealer.

I hope they are faster with you. First thing I'd do is find out who the regional rep is, and if he will be close enough to come check your bike out soon. In hindsight, that would have been a much faster route. The regional rep is usually a moto guy, and has authorization to make the call on the spot, rather than the extended process of sending parts to the YES warranty rep and waiting for him/her to look at them and make a decision. (My dealer didn't find that out until the week after the regional rep had been there.

 

[tomatocity]

No problem, just tell me what you need or print the forum post and show it to your dealer.

I hope they are faster with you. First thing I'd do is find out who the regional rep is, and if he will be close enough to come check your bike out soon. In hindsight, that would have been a much faster route. The regional rep is usually a moto guy, and has authorization to make the call on the spot, rather than the extended process of sending parts to the YES warranty rep and waiting for him/her to look at them and make a decision. (My dealer didn't find that out until the week after the regional rep had been there.

Thanks Eric. I am sure this will help expedite this case. I will check with the Dealer on Tuesday and provide them with a copy of the thread from the forum and show them the same on a computer. Including the The Regional Rep as soon as possible is a good idea. Is there a list of the parts replaced on your thread?

 

[Big Blu]

Points to ponder,,,

High speed and high RPM can be two different things,,,
High Test has more cleansing additives than Regular,,,
What type of oil is being used,,,

My '12 would burn a bit of oil when cruising in the 75-90 mph range, could be a factor.
I seem to recall Yamaha redesign the piston rings on the '14. Could that have been a response to the issue of carbon build up/oil usage?

Paul

 

[dcstrom]

Tomatocity... you were asking about VIN numbers? Mine is #70, and had what sounds like the exact same problem as you - only at 76,000 miles, not 53,000. Looks like I got lucky again - that happened in Paris and Yamaha fixed it for free. 53,000 was somewhere around the bottom end of South America, which would have meant an expensive, embarrassing and demoralising truck ride to Santiago or Buenos Aires.

But anyway, it sounds exactly the same, except I don't remember seeing the code 14. However that might be because my vision clouded over when I realised what just happened... Tech at Yamaha France said the chain had jumped 4 teeth without bending any valves. Lucky or what?

I'm wondering what my engine's looking like inside - I haven't run premium gas really since leaving the states, and in places in South America I ran 84 octane. It didn't run great and I was gentle on the throttle, and usually threw in some octane booster, but it was ok. Since then I haven't run premium even when it's available. I have however given her a dose of injector cleaner once in a while. So between the low-quality gas and the wide variety of oils I've been running (often can't get what I'd prefer, but always managed to get some kind of branded semi-synth motorcycle oil), I'm curious how it's looking. I don't run high speeds very much, and it uses about 500ml between changes at 4-5,000 miles. So not a lot, but more than it used 50,000 miles ago.

My '14 tensioner has been in for 10,000 miles now, still very quiet.

Good luck with your warranty claim!

 

[olie]

My '12 would burn a bit of oil when cruising in the 75-90 mph range, could be a factor.
I seem to recall Yamaha redesign the piston rings on the '14. Could that have been a response to the issue of carbon build up/oil usage?

Paul

hmm... I used to notice the same but not always when the oil is well over 2500 miles. Not lately. Typically I change oil (valvoline 20w50) at about 3500 miles.

 

[BWC]

Thought this might relate to the carbon build up shown in the previous pics.
First pic taken in 2012 when the throttle bodies were removed for a valve clearance check to get an idea of the factory set clearances for future reference. Noticed a bit of build up on the intake valves. 2014 pic. is when I did the first valve adjust at 81,000 km. Bike has always run great and never burnt any noticeable amount of oil between changes and I try and run premium when available. Asked around a bit and the local marine store from their experience recommended the Yamalube product. http://www.yamaha-motor.com/outboard/Ethanol_Fuel_Flyer.pdf
I'm not one for fuel or oil additives but this product seems to be working. I've been using it in every 2nd-3rd tank full, or when I remember and it seems to be helping.
Large bottle is the concentrate and treats up to 300 liters, small bottle is non concentrate and good for one 20 liter treatment. I now just put the concentrate in the small bottle and carry it with me.
And would this amount of carbon build up be considered normal? So next question is causes. Bike isn't used for much commuting, mostly long distance travel. I did have an issue with a dirty fuel filter from bad fuel although I don't know if it would cause this sort of build up, could depend on the type of fuel contamination I suppose.

 

[snakebitten]

Pictures are LOUD.

You sure those clean valves are you showing off those sweet brand new 2014's?
Just messin.

Thanks.