Will you take the vaccine

[Jlq1969]

In my country, the same thing happens and in the same proportions as in the rest of the countries, which is similar (in the same proportions) to what happened or happens in my intimate "circle" of people around me (among relatives , friends, employees, acquaintances)…..at the beginning of the covid and before the vaccines, some were infected, others were not. Of those infected, some had a good time, others had a very bad time, and "in proportion", very few died... but the common characteristic among those infected was always the same, "pneumonia"... those who were infected with covid, “and developed pneumonia” ((Inflammation in the lungs can be caused by viruses or bacteria, but it is very difficult to control and the damage caused by hypoxia is faster than the healing process)).….they are the ones who had a bad time or died (depending on the degree of pneumonia: simple or bilateral)…..covid by itself does not kill you….what killed those who died was hypoxia caused by bilateral pneumonia and multiorgan failure that causes lack of oxygen. The idea of getting vaccinated 3 or 4 times in a year (never seen before), is simple... the vaccine "is not a cure, it is not an antidote", it simply "teaches" your immune system to generate antibodies to fight it. The same vaccine generates herd immunity but in an accelerated and controlled manner, and without the mutations typical of viruses. When your immune system already "controlled" all the covids you had in your blood, it simply "goes to rest"... it no longer produces antibodies... it is waiting for the monitoring system to tell him what "pathogen" it found in the blood to produce specific antibodies only for "that pathogen" (that's why covid antibody levels in blood, decline over time)... with a new vaccine... your immune system comes out of rest and regenerates antibodies, which will be circulating in the blood for about 4-6 months and if in that period you “catch live viruses”….the control will be immediate….if you don’t have antibodies circulating in your blood, your immune system already has the record saved in its memory (if you were vaccinated or contracted by herd), it already knows how to attack it, but it needs time to produce antibodies (a couple of days)….and “remembering” that viruses have the ability to “hide” inside cells, is that the control period extends more…they mentioned the flu It is something similar to covid. Permanently at every hour of the day you are inhaling the flu virus... and your system is permanently controlling it, until 2 things happen: either for some reason you are in a clean area and you stopped inhaling it (and your blood antibodies decreased) or you have another problem and your immune system is “distracted”….when this happens you simply get sick and feel bad for 7-10 days…
Regarding the masks, they “work”, they REDUCE the probability of contagion, but of course “there are to change them often”……they themselves are a breeding ground for bacteria, fungi, etc……during the Spanish flu, deaths began to increase exponentially after the use of the mask was implemented, but they died of other things such as bacterial pneumonia , tuberculosis, etc... and at that time penicillin did not yet exist….

 

[Jlq1969]

The race against covid is similar to a bank robbery. "Let's suppose" that 5 friends who have 5 different motorcycles decide to rob a bank (u$ 50 million), in a town, and escape to a border that lacks control, the only thing that separates the bank from the border, is a long 10 mile paved straight. What they know for sure is that there are 50 million, that the police will take 7 minutes to get to the bank and that the police ride 5 Superteneres (which would be the covid)….and they ride 5 different motorcycles: 1 SAS 1290, 1 Ducati V4 , 1 Gs 1250, 1 S10 (these would be the vaccinated ones)….and 1 Ktm 390 adventure (which would be the anti-vaccine)….they know that they have to start the race at the latest in minute 5…so that when the chase starts, they have enough distance for them to cross the border (especially 390)…and to prevent the shots from hitting the target. At minute 5, they leave the bank with the 50 million, each one gets on his motorcycle and the unexpected happens, the S10 pilot released the start button, before it really started (he is not in this forum)... on the second attempt it didn't start either….already on the third one it started (it was minute 6:30)….and the police were 3/4 of a mile behind them….they started to flee at “maximum” speed….The SAS Y the V4, they move away from the police, the Gs and the S10, although they do not move away, they maintain the 3/4 mile that separates them from the police and avoid being the target of the shots…..and that of the 390 , who was also coming at top speed, was caught. He already knew in advance that his only chance to escape from the police was to leave in minute 5….and making a comparison, being sure that he was going to leave in minute 5. It is the same as “believing that your immune system is fast and perfect, that it is 100%, how to be sure of it?…..there is only one way to know and that is to “put it to the test”…..or…if the 390 adv had bought an S10 to escape (2011 was enough, that is, he would have been vaccinated)…..he no longer had to depend on the 5 minutes maximum (that is, to be sure that his immune system is 100% effective)

 

[lund]

I think today many people in the world have become much more self serving over the greater good of humanity.
They would rather allow others to suffer over taking a risk of possible harm. Similarly to someone who fell over board on a ship and you have the life line but are leery of throwing it just in case you slipped and went over yourself because there are no guard rails. So you don't.
There are people in the world that will take in lost or stranded strangers into their homes and while in their home are under the landlords protection no matter what. (Some middle eastern countries are well known for this) The world needs more people like this.
The interweb has been a great tool for many things but those having an agenda over their simple minded thoughts it has been weaponized to drive there cause.( QAnon example)
When I was young I was vaccinated at school for many things(chicken pox, measles and others, it was a long time ago).
I was in the service and did 3 tours, Cyprus and 2 in Bosnia and before deploying a regiment of vaccine of who knows what was given to all.
Today the Covid vaccine is nothing, I trust the science and like science it continually changes as we learn but more importantly is the end goal.
Stopping the spread to others for humanity.
Those who choose not to join the fight against Covid proves the fact that they are self serving and cannot be relied on with a life line.
IMO it should not be a choice when it interferes with a majority right to be safe. JMO

 

[AZMike]

Some of us simple minded rubes are not inclined to let the nanny state tyrants take control of my body and my freedom. All this for something that has a 99% survival rate. Trust the Science? Fauci says he is the science. Science is about the discovery and the scrutiny of all the is known and to challenge the stated dogma. Do any of you find it interesting that Facebook, Utube, and Twitter as well as the MSM will suppress anyone who dares question the State opinion? Are you comfortable with that? Remove the word Covid and insert abortion or beef or alcohol or cigarettes or motorcycles or voting or whatever else we choose to do in our lives and tell us we can't have or do that. The Shots DO NOT stop transmission so why are you afraid of me? The countries with the highest vaccination rates have the highest Covid cases. This is a miserable failure. What happened to my body my choice?

 

[Sierra1]

1) I haven't trusted Fauci since day one. Back when everybody thought he was the second coming. My wife asked me how I knew. There was just something about the way he spoke.
2) I question everything, and demand proof with facts. One of the main reasons I ride a Tenere, and not a GS. I'm not a sheeple.
3) Fakebook is flooded with anti-vax propaganda. I find it interesting that there is no pro-vax propaganda. Likely because of my wife's "friends" group.
4) The vaccine does not stop virus transmission. As jlq stated, it does start your body's defense system.
5) It's still your body your choice. But, if it's their company, their rules.
6) I don't want to be in that 1%.

 

[Wallkeeper]

In consideration of Lund's comment, I think a quote from Thomas Jefferson might be applicable. At the time he wrote this he was being accused of violating the U.S. Constitution and the "written law" he is referencing is the U.S. Constitution

"A strict observance of the written law is doubtless one of the high duties of a good citizen, but it is not the highest. The laws of necessity, of self-preservation, of saving our country when in danger, are of higher obligation. To lose our country by a scrupulous adherence to the written law, would be to lose the law itself, with life, liberty, property and all those who are enjoying them with us; thus absurdly sacrificing the ends to the means "

 

[Eville Rich]

Good discussion. Not clear why anti-vaxxers need to call others "rubes" or "servants of a nanny state." But I know it helps many manage their own feelings, so I don't care that much. I do think it interesting that a 1% death rate is viewed as "acceptable losses" for some vague goal, but whatever.

What I do find puzzling is the idea that science can be simply ignored under the notion that "science is supposed to be challenged." Yes, science should be challenged, but is really just a pathway to develop data, information, and knowledge. However, simply raising a question is not how science is challenged. Science is challenged with more science. Asking a question about a scientific topic can be a direction for investigation, but is not equivalent to actually doing the science and developing results - and then further scientific investigation to understand those results. In short, I welcome more scientific investigation, but until you do the research, the questioning is as meaningless as saying "but the moon might be made of green cheese."

 

[Wallkeeper]

Time for me to put on my Moderator Hat (it hurts my head)

This can be a contentious topic but lets keep it polite and not ascribe derogratory conclusions to anyone in the discussion.

 

[iliadz]

Literally, not a single person in this thread will change their mind on their belief. It's really a moot point. I am not going to convince you to be atheist, if you are religious, nor vice versa.
And I am certainly not going to convince you to get a vaccine if you don't believe in them, nor not to get one, if you do believe in them.
People who get vaccines are:
a. brilliant
b. sheep
c. brilliant sheep.
you chose one, a long time ago, absolutely nothing in this thread will change our minds.

I know this is the debate room, but, politics, religion, and vaccinations do not make good bedfellows.

 

[Sierra1]

Yet, in this case, all three of those are intertwined.

 

[magic]

I believe in the science that the vaccines are effective and really our only way out of this pandemic. Case in point, I have a brother in law age 62. He has a slight learning disability, has many risk factors for covid. Obesity, renal failure, diabetes, COPD, high BP, to name a few. He has dialysis 3x a week. The anti-rejection medications he has been taking have rendered him immunocompromised. (He had a kidney transplant about 15 years ago). He is at an assisted living facility and is tested weekly. 2 weeks ago he tested positive for covid. He was fully vaccinated and boosted. We thought for sure this was the end of the road for him. Somehow, he only had mild symptoms and the latest test came back negative. His doctor said either it was a miracle or the vaccine that saved him.

Fortunately, he didn't have to be hospitalized. The CEOs from the area medical groups are on the news everyday. They all report that their hospital ICUs are full of covid patients and more than 90% are unvaccinated.

 

[Sierra1]

My wife presented symptoms on Tuesday. She's all but over it today. Her niece is on day 10 with no end in sight. My wife has had her three shots, the niece has had none. And it's an apples-to-apples comparison since they are very similar physically.

 

[Berg_Donk]

This is an analysis of hospitalisations here in NSW. The full story here; https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/ng-interactive/2022/jan/28/the-simple-numbers-every-government-should-use-to-fight-anti-vaccine-misinformation?utm_term=61f5e31477cbe6917d95afedaf89c675&utm_campaign=GuardianTodayAUS&utm_source=esp&utm_medium=Email&CMP=GTAU_email

 

[Sierra1]

View attachment 88623

This is an analysis of hospitalisations here in NSW. The full story here; https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/ng-interactive/2022/jan/28/the-simple-numbers-every-government-should-use-to-fight-anti-vaccine-misinformation?utm_term=61f5e31477cbe6917d95afedaf89c675&utm_campaign=GuardianTodayAUS&utm_source=esp&utm_medium=Email&CMP=GTAU_email

If those numbers are right, only 1% of N.S.W. is unvaccinated. Impressive. I saw a graphic on the news yesterday that 60% of the US has had two doses, and 45% has had the booster.

 

[fac191]

Maybe it would if they rode a Tenere.

Now that is a sensible reply.

 

[fac191]

Let's hope the World pulls together better to fight Climate Change.

 

[iliadz]

Ha, in the words of Macklemore...

We live on social media, read other people's thoughts
Tweet about justice, but don't show up to the march
I think about the earth and I think about the eco
What am I willing to sacrifice at the expense of my ego?...

 

[Sierra1]

Let's hope the World pulls together better to fight Climate Change.

I believe in climate change. I don't believe humans are to blame. We're not helping it, but we can't stop it. It's the cycle of the planet. Five ice ages so far.

 

[WJBertrand]

Let's hope the World pulls together better to fight Climate Change.

This is even more politically obscured than Covid. Every country wants to twist the interpretation of the data to meet their own agendas. Seems the only hard indisputable data seems to be that temps are indeed rising. I’m skeptical man is totally responsible but even if we were, our efforts might be better served to adapt, there’s no way to stop it without mass economic bankrupting of global economies.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Sierra1]

Politics shouldn't be involved. It's a science thing. The planet has cooled, and warmed, way before we were driving F-350s to work at our coal fired plants. Even before ol' T-Rex took his first poop. I saw a show the other day where they've found massive methane pockets in far north Siberia, venting into the atmosphere. Nothing at all to do with mankind.