Oil change gone bad... Help!

[MikeBear]

There is short one they make.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/F-109-12mm-1-5-Fumoto-Oil-Drain-Valve-Ships-Free-/270583724722?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3f000bfab2&vxp=mtr

Ther is also one with nipple to attach draining hose

 

[TreeMuncher]

I would recommend using a shop-vac at the same time you drill or tap to extract any chips from the machining process during a helicoil installation. Remove the oil fill cap so that air can get into the motor and exit the drain hole that you are working on. Keep the vacuum end right next to the hole you are machining while you drill or tap it out.

You might be able to use kerosene or diesel to flush the case after the machining process and suck it out with the vac.

You might even consider making a fitting that would cover the hole with a vacuum port but still let you drill through the pan thus providing the maximum amount of suction and airflow to extract every chip possible. I'm thinking that some clear vinyl tubing that they sell in the plumbing dept of Lowes might make such a fixture.

 

[Kevhunts]

You can buy a sump cover for $160 +/- if you want 2 brand new oil drain plug holes.

23P-13417-00-00

COVER, STRAINER

 

[JonnyCinco]

Agree with RonH. Think you are overreacting and going through more trouble. Put the plug back in with a new crush washer, Torque to spec and SAFETY wire it. Check it after a few miles for dripping, but I do not think you will have any.

 

[Kestrel]

Curious ... how do you safety wire the S10's drain plugs? Are you drilling holes in the drain plug? If so, what are you securing the wire to?

 

[MrTwisty]

A heli coil will fix it, but these are better IMHO.

http://www.ezlok.com/InsertsMetal/carbonSteel.html

They are less likely to come apart or come out.

 

[behindbars]

FYI- Here's another option which some folks claim are superior to Helicoils. You do have to countersink the hole first.



+ TIME-SERT + THREAD REPAIR SYSTEM www.timesert.com thread repair kits stripped thread repair kit.

 

[MikeBear]

Yes. Those look very solid, but I don't think I matters in my case. I will be putting qwikvalve same time as heli-coil and both will go in with generous amount of red threadlocker. Neither one will ever be coming out...ever.

 

[scott123007]

Since this is already a two page thread on what is a relatively easy fix, I'll throw in my two cents also. There has been some accurate and not so accurate advise given, so just for the record....
1) Do NOT Tap your drain plug hole the way that HACK on the You Tube video that Tabasco posted shows. The way that guy used that Tap is so wrong that I can't believe he even posted it.
2) Follow Don in Lodi's advise verbadem on the correct procedure to do the job (including how to properly use a Tap) with the EXCEPTION of using Locktite on the helicoil itself. It is not recommended nor does it accomplish anything.( You don't locktite piston circlips, do you?)
3) If you are going to attempt this helicoil yourself, and this is your first time, practice a couple of times on something other than your oil pan.
4) For final crankcase shavings evacuation, as Treemuncher says, use a Shop Vac.
5) I would strongly recommend AGAINST using anything that extends the drain closer to the ground, even if you do have a bash plate. Those quick drains are for engines that are run almost constantly and need frequent oil changes, or engines with very hard to access drains, not machinery that spends its life traversing terrain that could easily rip that drain off or smash your bash plate into it and cause you WAY more problems than you have now.
If I were in your shoes I would remove the oil pan. It makes the job much easier for yourself,( or you can take it somewhere) and no shavings to worry about. The gasket is only around 12 dollars.
Good Luck

 

[~TABASCO~]

X2 Take off the pan and get it up on a work bench so you can see what your doing.. Keep in mind that the pan is cast and not billet.. Its some-what a one shot deal...

Can you post a picture of the threads? You might be OK with this whole deal ??

I threw up that quick VID just to show what a heli-coil was in case the first gentleman didn't know.. Its in no way to be represented as the "right way" to install or work on anything... Just gives a quick idea.. Im sure there are way better videos that represent better.. I didn't have time to look though 50 of them though..

 

[Baja Explorer]

Why don't you just order a new pan ?

 

[Dallara]

~

Not that anybody really asked me...

But Scott123007 is exactly right on every point, IMHO.

Further, and these are just my opinions, but they are based on a fair amount of experience... I wouldn't use a Heli-Coil on a lawn mower. Over the years I have seen far, far too many fail. Often this is due to improper installation, but I've also them come out simply due to their own failure. I have also see them cause cracks in thin castings (like your sump), etc. Just my two centavos, but if you stripped it here are my choices for repair in order of preference:

1.) Replace the sump with a new one, but if that's too pricey, then...
2.) Pull the sump, have a good welder hard-weld up the hole, then drill it and re-tap, but if that scares you too much, then...
3.) Pull the sump and use a *TIME-SERT* - http://www.timesert.com/ - IMHO they are far, far superior to a Heli-Coil. I spent a lot of years in professional racing, and on vehicles worth literally millions, and I never saw any builder/fabricator/etc. worth his salt that would use a Heli-Coil.

And like Scott123007, I think one would be rather foolish to use something like a Fumoto valve on a motorcycle. IMHO, it hangs down way too far, and in the case of the Super Tenere it would be way too easy to snag it and snap it right off the sump causing the bike to dump all the oil out, not only leaving you stranded with a near impossible repair but perhaps fragging the engine in the process. That sump is a *THIN* casting, and even with a skid plate it wouldn't take much to punch that Fumoto valve right up through that pan casting.

After all, it takes all of about 10 minutes to change the oil on the S-10. How much easier do you need it to be? And what happens if somehow, somewhere, hundreds of miles from home, by an errant branch thrown up, or heaven forbid - vandalism - that little Fumoto lever gets flipped to the drain position when it's not supposed to?

As for the person who asked about safety wiring the drain plugs...

1.) Yes, you drill a hole through the drain plug bolt head, most commonly through from one flat to the one on the opposite of the hex.
2.) With the Super Tenere you have it easy - You simply safety wire the two drain bolts to each other.

Hope this helps!

Dallara




~

 

[JonnyCinco]

Curious ... how do you safety wire the S10's drain plugs? Are you drilling holes in the drain plug? If so, what are you securing the wire to?

Yep, drill a hole through. You can attach it to anything that does not move. It's just a safe guard to make sure it doesnt spin out.

 

[MikeBear]

Ok. One question
Everybody taking about different inserts. What about simple retaping for bigger plug? Isn't it simpler and cheaper?

 

[JonnyCinco]

For the love of jeebuzz. Is your bike leaking now? If not, how do you know that your threads are trashed? Why not just put a new crush washer on, torque it down and safety that sumbeach and see if it leaks.

The safety wire will prevent it from coming out, but it will let is loosen if the threads are jacked. Just check it frequently for the first coupla hundo miles. ::021::

 

[motocephalic]

Ok. One question
Everybody taking about different inserts. What about simple retaping for bigger plug? Isn't it simpler and cheaper?

the metal threads you described is classical for an over-tightening of the drain plug. It should leak slightly the way it is. I have sent the helicoil to you in today's mail. That is how I would permanently fix it. It is simple and permanent. Happy trails.

 

[MikeBear]

the metal threads you described is classical for an over-tightening of the drain plug. It should leak slightly the way it is. I have sent the helicoil to you in today's mail. That is how I would permanently fix it. It is simple and permanent. Happy trails.

I checked in the morning and found plug being just a little wet. Nothing on the floor thou.

 

[Jerry]

New Pan and be done with it. For $160 thats the fastest and best way.

 

[Don in Lodi]

D'oh ::010:: Pull the pan!.... Sheesh.
Oh, and drilling for the next size... usually there is only so much metal formed into the pan for the plug to occupy. The thread pitches are enough different I don't think you can go up to a half inch, and it's only thousandths different, you'd have to go all the way up to 14mm. Less and less metal. Did you see the photo of that silly stud being cut off the belly? They used so little metal in the casting that cutting the stud off left a hole in the pan. Bare minimum equals lighter weight. I know, ounces aren't pounds, but it adds up. I sure woulda liked a two pound sump pan.

 

[thfraser]

Good thread...

1) it shows that we have some very generious members on this list (lending tools to someone sight unseen is to be commended, and totally impressive)
2) There are multiple ways to solve the issue, some better than others.
3) Some folks here have some excellent knowledge on various topics and are willing to share it. Even if it, on occasion, results in some pushback.

Now IMO, if it's affordable, depending on if you've mortgaged the house for Christmas, I do like the idea of replacing the pan, and or pulling it. Stadium Yamaha offers a discount to us S10 members. Jaxon (Tabasco) posted this in the Vendor sectoin. Another inmate and I bought a years supply of consumables from them, price was very good and by buying a ton, we saved on shipping too.