Stevenson, It is a glitch, not a catastrophic failure. Like others have said, probably a seal, Yamaha will stand behind this, and it surely doesn't imply a rear diff that will take a dump in 20k or less!!!!
Final Drive Oil Leak
- Thread starter stevenson911
- Start date
There's a few oil seals in the shaft area. Just one of those flukes and the good thing about it is the hole is there to inform you there's an issues.
http://www.cheapcycleparts.com/model_years/13755-yamaha-2012-super-tenere--xtz12bcl/assemblies/273669-drive-shaft
Mine just had some gunk and brake dust in it and after riding in the rain there may be some minimal leaking that's normal.
http://www.cheapcycleparts.com/model_years/13755-yamaha-2012-super-tenere--xtz12bcl/assemblies/273669-drive-shaft
Mine just had some gunk and brake dust in it and after riding in the rain there may be some minimal leaking that's normal.
As a continued owner of the marque, I've gotta defend the BMW cause a bit.
Most of the "final drive failures" that people like to bash BMW so much about are exactly minor oil leaks like this guy is experiencing. Occasionally, they explode and leave you stranded, but this is rare compared to the minor leaks that make a mess but get you home. And one should always keep in mind that there are perhaps 100x more BMW GS final drives out there in the field being bashed about as there are S10 final drives.
The S10 final drive is a new design and we're really not at a point where we have enough data to know if seal leaks like this are going to be common or rare. (I did the research and reports that the S10 final drive is identical, or even similar, to other Yamaha shaft drive systems, are simply not true.) I fully expect Yamaha's final drive to be very reliable, both because of Yamaha's history of reliability in this area and because it is a much more robust, less failure-prone design with a conventional double-sided swingarm. But we don't have enough long-term data to be saying much yet.
Let's play fair. Our Yamahas aren't perfect either.
- Mark
Most of the "final drive failures" that people like to bash BMW so much about are exactly minor oil leaks like this guy is experiencing. Occasionally, they explode and leave you stranded, but this is rare compared to the minor leaks that make a mess but get you home. And one should always keep in mind that there are perhaps 100x more BMW GS final drives out there in the field being bashed about as there are S10 final drives.
The S10 final drive is a new design and we're really not at a point where we have enough data to know if seal leaks like this are going to be common or rare. (I did the research and reports that the S10 final drive is identical, or even similar, to other Yamaha shaft drive systems, are simply not true.) I fully expect Yamaha's final drive to be very reliable, both because of Yamaha's history of reliability in this area and because it is a much more robust, less failure-prone design with a conventional double-sided swingarm. But we don't have enough long-term data to be saying much yet.
Let's play fair. Our Yamahas aren't perfect either.
- Mark
I have a good riding buddy w/170k miles on his 1150 GS and no FD issues at all.
My 2008 ST1300 did have a failed u-joint at 50k miles so sometimes 'things just happen'.. still love my ST as well as my S10.. okay, love is a bit strong.. I appreciate both bikes and enjoy their company.. LOL
My 2008 ST1300 did have a failed u-joint at 50k miles so sometimes 'things just happen'.. still love my ST as well as my S10.. okay, love is a bit strong.. I appreciate both bikes and enjoy their company.. LOL
tenerejack
New Member
I had the same leak except at the other end of that shaft. There's another hole at the other end. It happened at a couple hundred miles. The only reason I noticed was because I parked on asphalt and tucked my helmet under the general are for the front of that shaft. Oil had leaked down on my face shield, I would say about 5 - 7 drops. I rubbed my finger along the bottom of that connection and felt it coming from that little hole. At first I was a bit tweeked but I kept an eye on it and never saw another drop. I did 9 1/2 hours in the saddle on Saturday and checked when I got home and it's still dry. Who the hell knows but I would just monitor it and make sure it's taken care of b4 the warranty runs out.stevenson911 said:
justbob
"crashin' sucks"
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The percentage of FD failures (not leaks) among BMW owners that I personally know is way too high.
Most of these were bearing failures, myself included.
Looks like the latest bad news for BMW is a recall for the S1000RR sport bike, being recalled to replace connecting rod bolts.
Apparently they have had some motors come apart, oops.
Most of these were bearing failures, myself included.
Looks like the latest bad news for BMW is a recall for the S1000RR sport bike, being recalled to replace connecting rod bolts.
Apparently they have had some motors come apart, oops.
dave6
Member
Mine is perfect........so there!!!! Put that in your final drive and smoke it!!! lol. Even if it decides not to be perfect, I wouldn't tell a BMW rider about it...lolmarkjenn said:
You're just doing that out of habitmarkjenn said:
But I agree with what you said. Except when you get GS's being used as intended. Then they seem to get issues. All those 5Km stop/starts to the Coffee shop. They can't handle it I tell ya. ::024::
Good luck with the recall.
stevenson911
New Member
Bummer man, I already wrote most of this once and then lost it to who knows where.
::022::
So I dropped the bike off just before noon today and about 3pm the Service Manager at Desert Valley Motorsports in Prosser, WA (where I bought it 1 week ago) called and said it was the rear axle oil seal. Further, he said they would replace another seal as well (I suspect the final drive oil seal).
The technician topped of the final drive oil (about 3oz's) and took it for a ride reproducing what I had already said (oil from the drain hole). When he opened it up the oil was clean, no dirt and no broken/ abused parts (hopefully he keeps the seal for me to see).
The Service Manager was waiting for a call from Yamaha about the availability of parts and the arrival date. About an hour later he calls back and says the parts are coming from Japan second day air. Apparently, and this is his word, no other Super T in America has needed an axle seal and produced this issue. That's good news for the rest of the Super T riders of America, right?
Anyhows, he and Yamaha supposedly are all over this..............and at the very least, the dealership is working hard to maintain customer satisfaction.
Peace ::003::
::022::
So I dropped the bike off just before noon today and about 3pm the Service Manager at Desert Valley Motorsports in Prosser, WA (where I bought it 1 week ago) called and said it was the rear axle oil seal. Further, he said they would replace another seal as well (I suspect the final drive oil seal).
The technician topped of the final drive oil (about 3oz's) and took it for a ride reproducing what I had already said (oil from the drain hole). When he opened it up the oil was clean, no dirt and no broken/ abused parts (hopefully he keeps the seal for me to see).
The Service Manager was waiting for a call from Yamaha about the availability of parts and the arrival date. About an hour later he calls back and says the parts are coming from Japan second day air. Apparently, and this is his word, no other Super T in America has needed an axle seal and produced this issue. That's good news for the rest of the Super T riders of America, right?
Anyhows, he and Yamaha supposedly are all over this..............and at the very least, the dealership is working hard to maintain customer satisfaction.
Peace ::003::
Good to hear they are looking after you.
YAMAHA seem pretty good in the main with this stuff. ::008::
YAMAHA seem pretty good in the main with this stuff. ::008::
Combo
DSN
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That's good news.stevenson911 said:
I have had very good service and response from Yamaha since 1976 and a good dealer to deal with is worth a lot.
stevenson911
New Member
Part 1
I made an appearance today at Desert Valley Motorsports (parts diagram with me) in an attempt to clarify differences I found in the shop managers explanation and the exploded parts diagram. I've tried to attach pictures and the parts diagram twice already, apparently the file is too big. Unfortunately, the site program remediation for the oversized attachment file is to send the whole package, narrative included, into oblivion never to be found?
This time I'll split the dialogue and pictures into multiple posts, hopefully it works.
The suspect "Oil Seal" (PN#93102-50009-00, or #14 on the diagram) sits at the back of the "Gear Coupling" (PN#23P-46125-00-00, or #15 on the diagram). The seal was still sealed in the drive housing, as pictured, so the opposite side hasn't been seen yet. The seal is the orangish looking ring being pointed to.
Inside the coupling are 2 holes (shown in the picture) that allow the gear coupling and the drive shaft mating surfaces to be bathed in oil.
I made an appearance today at Desert Valley Motorsports (parts diagram with me) in an attempt to clarify differences I found in the shop managers explanation and the exploded parts diagram. I've tried to attach pictures and the parts diagram twice already, apparently the file is too big. Unfortunately, the site program remediation for the oversized attachment file is to send the whole package, narrative included, into oblivion never to be found?
This time I'll split the dialogue and pictures into multiple posts, hopefully it works.
The suspect "Oil Seal" (PN#93102-50009-00, or #14 on the diagram) sits at the back of the "Gear Coupling" (PN#23P-46125-00-00, or #15 on the diagram). The seal was still sealed in the drive housing, as pictured, so the opposite side hasn't been seen yet. The seal is the orangish looking ring being pointed to.
Inside the coupling are 2 holes (shown in the picture) that allow the gear coupling and the drive shaft mating surfaces to be bathed in oil.
Attachments
stevenson911
New Member
Part 2
Note 2 small holes in back of coupling to allow oil in.
Note 2 small holes in back of coupling to allow oil in.
Attachments
stevenson911
New Member
Part 3
Gear coupling inside drive housing. Suspect leaker seal sits behind this.
Gear coupling inside drive housing. Suspect leaker seal sits behind this.
Attachments
stevenson911
New Member
Part 4
Technician pointing out the seal behind the gear coupling.
Technician pointing out the seal behind the gear coupling.
Attachments
stevenson911
New Member
Part 5
Okay, sorry guys, my new camera uses to much memory and it appears 1 pic is all I can download at one time.
So, on the forward side of the gear coupling is another "Oil Seal" (PN#93108-490003-00, or #39 on the diagram) that, in conjuction with the other seal is designed to keep the gear oil inside the gear coupling and around the "Gear Set" (PN#23P-461A0-00-00, or #8 on the diagram). Of course it follows that if a seal is bad, oil will make its way to the now famous weep hole on the bottom side of the drive housing.
Again, no damage was found, an apparent anomaly.
Okay, sorry guys, my new camera uses to much memory and it appears 1 pic is all I can download at one time.
So, on the forward side of the gear coupling is another "Oil Seal" (PN#93108-490003-00, or #39 on the diagram) that, in conjuction with the other seal is designed to keep the gear oil inside the gear coupling and around the "Gear Set" (PN#23P-461A0-00-00, or #8 on the diagram). Of course it follows that if a seal is bad, oil will make its way to the now famous weep hole on the bottom side of the drive housing.
Again, no damage was found, an apparent anomaly.
Attachments
stevenson911
New Member
::025::
Last one for today.
The seal on the forward side of the gear coupling will also be replaced for good measure (if I didn't already say that).
The shop manager restated this is the only issue with the drive assembly in the US, so far. Parts are enroute from Japan, completion in 2-3 days. Yamaha has requested the parts for a forensic analysis.
Sorry for the drawn-out post.
Jerry
Last one for today.
The seal on the forward side of the gear coupling will also be replaced for good measure (if I didn't already say that).
The shop manager restated this is the only issue with the drive assembly in the US, so far. Parts are enroute from Japan, completion in 2-3 days. Yamaha has requested the parts for a forensic analysis.
Sorry for the drawn-out post.
Jerry
Attachments
Appreciate the pics and report!
S911, Good for you to catch this and for the good/Prompt care your dealer affords you!
I have now dealt w/ three dealers: 3hrs from home(CT) for original purchase, 2000 miles from home(FL) for new tires installed when I was on a long road trip, and my local Yamy dealer(MA) for the fuel pump o-ring recall and a 4000 mi service - ALL of these dealers were very knowledgeable, super interested in the bike and my experience w/ it(like the whole shop came out to check it out) and I've been super satisfied and impressed w/ them All. As it sounds is the case w/ you and your dealer, That's Great to hear. This bodes very well for so many of us planning long-ass trips across the country and/or the planet; that may have to stop in for service far away frm home while on the road. ::002:: And was a factor definitely for myself and for so many of us when evaluating the original purchase. ::021::
A few drops of oil and ride on, not to worry. ::003::
Thnx for the write-up, d ::001::
::022::
I have now dealt w/ three dealers: 3hrs from home(CT) for original purchase, 2000 miles from home(FL) for new tires installed when I was on a long road trip, and my local Yamy dealer(MA) for the fuel pump o-ring recall and a 4000 mi service - ALL of these dealers were very knowledgeable, super interested in the bike and my experience w/ it(like the whole shop came out to check it out) and I've been super satisfied and impressed w/ them All. As it sounds is the case w/ you and your dealer, That's Great to hear. This bodes very well for so many of us planning long-ass trips across the country and/or the planet; that may have to stop in for service far away frm home while on the road. ::002:: And was a factor definitely for myself and for so many of us when evaluating the original purchase. ::021::
A few drops of oil and ride on, not to worry. ::003::
Thnx for the write-up, d ::001::
::022::
stevenson911
New Member
So this is nearly 3 weeks, 300 miles after repair and all is well. There was a bit of a hiccup in the Yamaha shop management area costing me a day or 2 but other than that I am satisfied. It seems the Service Manager was suddenly "let go".
The seal causing the issue was the seal that sits forward of the coupling gear not behind it as previously thought. Both seals were replaced for good measure.
In the picture, the smaller of the 2 seals is the culprit and appeared to be pinched during original assembly. Yamaha wanted them back for forensics.
I see another Super T brother is having a similar repair. I hope this isn't a sign of things to come.
Great bike, can't wait for some real rides.
Jerry
The seal causing the issue was the seal that sits forward of the coupling gear not behind it as previously thought. Both seals were replaced for good measure.
In the picture, the smaller of the 2 seals is the culprit and appeared to be pinched during original assembly. Yamaha wanted them back for forensics.
I see another Super T brother is having a similar repair. I hope this isn't a sign of things to come.
Great bike, can't wait for some real rides.
Jerry
