Cooked Headlamp Harness

[markjenn]

Take it to the dealer, document it, report it to the NHTSA reporting site, get a case file with case number through Yamaha corporate but do NOT ever assume anyone knows anything unless you have documented proof they they are aware.

While there is certainly nothing wrong with telling dealers and Yamaha directly about problems, I doubt it does a whole lot of good. What Yamaha monitors actively is warranty claims, everything else is pretty much background noise to them because it doesn't affect their bottom line.

- Mark

 

[ErnsTT]

What Yamaha monitors actively is warranty claims, everything else is pretty much background noise to them because it doesn't affect their bottom line.

That may be true for teh English/American market, but here Yamaha has even a monitor on the Partssupply, if an item that should only be ordered in a Crash or other weird mishap gets ordered more that X times a year, they get an Notification, there is something coocking...

Best way to get a problem noticed, is let the dealer order a new part, he gets a refund if its warrenty, and they arent skimpy overhere, they actually removed the Clutchcover from the Demo to replace mine which had an odd leak at a dovel, when the cover could not be ordered right away (rendering their Demobike useless untill the cover came out of Japan)

Even the silly mirror gets replaced in a few days for the second time, the OEM suppliers are really sloppy these days :-(

 

[Firefight911]

While there is certainly nothing wrong with telling dealers and Yamaha directly about problems, I doubt it does a whole lot of good. What Yamaha monitors actively is warranty claims, everything else is pretty much background noise to them because it doesn't affect their bottom line.

- Mark

Sorry, could not disagree more. Having worked in the industry and, myself, been an active recipient of two lemon law buyback motorcycles I can first handedly tell you that manufacturers monitor much more than just the warranty claim and warranty period of a vehicle.

Why not just say you're too lazy to do what would benefit you and everyone else?

 

[snuffcityrider]

I recently took my Ten in for it's 4000 mile service and told them to check the wires as I had noticed that the left headlight wire was not as black as the right one. They did not agree with my assement and noted that on the service record. I was dissapointed with their assement and guess I'll have to wait till there are flames shooting out the back for them to recongnize that's something is not right.

 

[snakebitten]

It may be true that they (Yamaha) are ignoring the issue. But again, I doubt they are unaware of it.

I respect your knowledge of the practices in the industry. Seriously, I do. And I don't doubt that Yamaha has official "processes" in place that they adhere to. And thus, it is true that they may not have a large number of "official" complaints.

But none of that would convince me that Yamaha is unaware. That's a completely different claim. The URL of this forum is likely to SHOUT its identity. No way could Yamaha be completely in the dark about what goes on here. They pay BIG money for marketing studies and research to decide what their customers want\don't want\like\dislike about their products. Forums like this aren't unknown and ignored. They are FREE gold. Somebody at Yamaha knows what is said here. I really believe that.

However, it doesn't mean they will do what we all want them to do. It's obvious that in this "cooked headlamp harness" thread they haven't. And you might be right that they won't unless we all follow through with some reporting process they have in place.

But I just don't care enough on THIS particular issue to follow through with their silly requirement.

I just want them to know that they are taking a calculated risk with me. But they know that. The real problem is they know I LOVE the dang bike and I have addressed the stupid headlight connector problem already.

Yea Yamaha, if you are listening, and I know you are, lol, I fixed it!

But don't push your luck!

 

[Firefight911]

But none of that would convince me that Yamaha is unaware. That's a completely different claim. The URL of this forum is likely to SHOUT its identity. No way could Yamaha be completely in the dark about what goes on here. They pay BIG money for marketing studies and research to decide what their customers want\don't want\like\dislike about their products. Forums like this aren't unknown and ignored. They are FREE gold. Somebody at Yamaha knows what is said here. I really believe that.

You can rest assured that there are people at Yamaha North America whose sole job is to scour the web and the forums such as this one for just such a thing. I have been contacted this way for issues I was having with my former BMW F800GS in just this fashion.

 

[snakebitten]

You can rest assured that there are people at Yamaha North America whose sole job is to scour the web and the forums such as this one for just such a thing. I have been contacted this way for issues I was having with my former BMW F800GS in just this fashion.

Perfect! In that case, Hey Yamaha, I'm the guy who bought the Super Tenere at Texas Yamaha in Webster Texas. The First one they got. The one the PDP purchaser backed out on. I called them 60 seconds BEFORE they opened for business that day. Confirmed the sale had fallen through. Told them it was MINE and I would be there in 10 minutes.

Paid cash. MSRP. Added 4 years of Yes. Added a 3 year service contract.

In summary, I waited the shortest amount of time of any S10 owner. Got the worst deal of anyone who purchased an S10. And NOBODY loves this bike more than me!

So I wouldn't lie to you Yamaha. Yaw got a problem with your headlamp connectors. They are defective. And it isn't just the ones you shipped to us yanks. OK?

Your happiest customer has spoken.

 

[Firefight911]

Now that right there is funny!!!!! Way to go Snakebitten!! Way to go!! ::012:: ::012:: ::012:: ::013:: ::013:: ::013::

 

[ErnsTT]

I just want them to know that they are taking a calculated risk with me. But they know that. The real problem is they know I LOVE the dang bike and I have addressed the stupid headlight connector problem already.

Its a silly easy ting to correct, with a 2$ nailfile, would not call that a risk, so get off your high horse back on your lowly Xt

But you are right Yamaha dealers know about customer satisfaction, i just have to mention Termaat anywhere, and Jeroen will read it

 

[roy]

I sit here reading all this and wonder why it was supposedly all in MY head way back when. : opps seems everytime I open this website another one has bit the dust err melted away. Mr. Yamaha Product Specialist exact words to me after he blasted me with everything under the sun as to why I was causing this to happen "There is no Problem". Yea right buddy who's laughing now, me dumbass yamaha phone boy. Keep waiting for them to fix it, it's not coming. )

Yes there is a problem with the headlight wiring, yes I still own this potential no lights after dark disaster, yes I still have those auxillary lights that were causing it to happen according to Mr. Yamaha himself. : I'd be a fool to remove them, hell I may need them to get home one night from tim buck too.

Yamaha SUCKS at the corporate level don't fool your self into thinking otherwise. I would never throw money at them for an extended warranty because it won't be worth jack in the end. They do not stand behind their product. Might as well have bought a BMW to begin with and took your chances of a final drive issue which really does not exist according to BMW. My first encounter with Yamaha was not good and I doubt I will throw any more money their way in the future. First impressions are the best. Ya'll do as you like and keep replacing headlight wires and connectors,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,and pack a maglite ::002::

 

[jajpko]

I have been checking mine and the wires finally started to turn color. Too much heat. I removed the headlight and the bad harness. After looking at the whole thing, in my opinion it is the size of the wires and not the connector. The female flags were very HD brass and the wire connections were vary good.

I had bought everything needed for the change over, so I decided to make it happen. The connectors I used were purchased from the Connector store on the net. I used 14ga. wire, a relay and the blue power wire as a trigger. I have to admit, it was a job, but in my humble opinion, well worth it.
I would love to have Yamaha replace the harness before the lights went out, but that is not gonna happen. I use my bike for trips and hate to be stranded.
When, of if, they do a recall I may have it replaced, but I don't think so.. ::025::
If you want to use ceramic it is a little harder to do, but I think a regular, smaller, high temp plastic will work.

On edit,,, the ceramic connectors that I used fit in the bucket nicely. If you are having problems putting the cap back on, use some dielectric grease on the O ring.

Here are some pics I took.

 

[snakebitten]

Its a silly easy ting to correct, with a 2$ nailfile, would not call that a risk, so get off your high horse back on your lowly Xt

But you are right Yamaha dealers know about customer satisfaction, i just have to mention Termaat anywhere, and Jeroen will read it

Hey ErnsTT, I gave you credit for being the one who "so excellently diagnosed the misshaped connectors" !

I was just funning Yamaha too. So far they have provided me with more than I expected from their Super Tenere.

However, I've stated clearly that I think they know now about the shoddy moulded part. And if I am right, they ARE calculating the risk of just not sending new ones to dealers and having them changed out quickly.

Far easier than the Fuel Pump o-ring!

Anyways, thanks dude for convincing me that your discovery was the true culprit here.

 

[creggur]

I was just funning Yamaha too. So far they have provided me with more than I expected from their Super Tenere.

However, I've stated clearly that I think they know now about the shoddy moulded part. And if I am right, they ARE calculating the risk of just not sending new ones to dealers and having them changed out quickly.

Far easier than the Fuel Pump o-ring!

Anyways, thanks dude for convincing me that your discovery was the true culprit here.

They are calculating the 'Cost', not the risk. And I have to agree with Firefight, having been in the fixed-ops end of the automotive business for 15-odd years, it has to be reported to Yamaha for them to do a proper analysis of the scope of the problem. The primary means of that reporting is through warranty claims and NHTSA reports. If a misshaped connector is the culprit they will likely release a Technical Service Bulletin having dealers modify the part for proper connection. At the same time they will get with their supplier to make sure future harnesses don't have this issue. If they deem the modification a proper fix, that will be the end of it with a redesigned harness going on all new bikes.

If problems persist, they will release a Campaign (what many here think of as a recall) that states any time a Super Tenere comes into a dealership for any reason it will get new connecters/harness fitted. If a certain number of bikes aren't completed in a certain time frame they are compelled (by the U.S. Government) to release a Safety Recall.

I assure you, the last thing Yamaha wants is a bunch of litigious Americans running around on their motorcycles with a potential safety issue such as a faulty electrical connector causing a heating problem and potential loss of light at night.

Been through this too many times with various manufacturers (automotive) and while the process takes a bit of time, I'm willing to bet they are working to get this corrected. Defending one lawsuit isn't worth the price of a few thousand headlight harnesses (the cost of which will likely be shared by the supplier). And they know that...

 

[Bigbore4]

^^^
yup

 

[Twisties]

Checked both bikes this morning, roughly 16 and 7 k miles respectively. Headlamp connectors and wires near connectors look new. No signs of discoloration, melting, burning, or over heating on the wires. I didn't feel the connectors, but the appearance is glossy black and newish. Not going to touch anything for now. Hopefully, if the problem proves widespread they will take action before ours develop issues. OBTW, my bike, with 16 k miles has several days of off road riding under it's belt, with some for real pounding. Bullett's not so much.

Interesting thread.

 

[markjenn]

I assure you, the last thing Yamaha wants is a bunch of litigious Americans running around on their motorcycles with a potential safety issue such as a faulty electrical connector causing a heating problem and potential loss of light at night.

Maybe I'm too devil-may-care about this, but I don't see how a single-point-of-failure problem that affects only one headlight on a dual-headlight system is a a significant safety risk. Annoying reliability risk, yes, but not a safety risk.

- Mark

 

[Bigbore4]

Maybe I'm too devil-may-care about this, but I don't see how a single-point-of-failure problem that affects only one headlight on a dual-headlight system is a a significant safety risk. Annoying reliability risk, yes, but not a safety risk.

- Mark

Depending on the how and why and how much the current goes up you could end up with a blown fuse, then it becomes a bigger deal, at night anyway.

FWIW I had my harness replaced under warranty this spring. When I went in to install my HID kit a couple weeks ago, the left side connector was just starting to melt. I used a small pocket knife (far more sophisticated and technical than a nail file doncha think?) and tweaked both sides of both connectors, they are nice and tight now where the plug onto the HID kit. And after the starting inrush, the HID's should draw less current.

 

[markjenn]

Depending on the how and why and how much the current goes up you could end up with a blown fuse, then it becomes a bigger deal, at night anyway.

If we've had this scenario with this problem, I haven't heard about it.

- Mark

 

[Dallara]

Maybe I'm too devil-may-care about this, but I don't see how a single-point-of-failure problem that affects only one headlight on a dual-headlight system is a a significant safety risk. Annoying reliability risk, yes, but not a safety risk.

- Mark

I think it may be important to note that this problem has not be specific to one side - left or right - or the other. Some have had the left side connector/wiring melt down. Others the right. Some have noted discoloration and deterioration to both sides, though only having one headlamp quit working. This suggests the entire harness is suspect along with both connectors. As such if you lose one side it is very possible you could also lose the other. If you are out just past where Moses lost his sandals this could be a real serious problem - and yes, a true "safety" one, especially if you are trying to negotiate a rock-strewn two-track as night is coming on as you try to get back to camp, etc. And I'd hate to have that second, still working headlamp suddenly blink out just as I was heading home at night and just saw two deer in the brush on the side of the road... ???

I also want to recall the correspondence I had with Jim Davis at Eastern Beaver. After sending him all the info on the headlamp sub-harness - wire sizes, types of plugs and connectors, pin sizes of plugs, etc. - he was quite positive, and emphatic, that the headlamp sub-harness was deficient in several areas, with, oddly enough, the plug from the main harness to the sub-harness being the most undersized and lacking in current capacity for the job. He also stated, as we all have found, that the H7 headlamp connector is also woefully inadequate, as any of even the slightest temperature increase to it causes it to degrade and crumble.

IMHO, the entire headlamp sub-harness, along with the plug and connector pins to the main harness, are essentially operated right on the *edge* of their design envelope. As such even the slightest hiccup or jiggled connection increases the resistance enough to put it over that *edge* and something melts.

Honestly, I think Yamaha has become aware of the problem, and is probably working on the simplest fix they can find with their sub-harness supplier. One day here in the not too distant future some solution from Yamaha will be forthcoming. It may not be a "recall" as pointed out by some well experienced folks here, but like they said, simply the new, improved harness slowly getting into the pipeline, with maybe a dealer TSB suggesting the harness be checked. And there is no doubt in my mind that when the next *generation* of the Super Tenere is introduced there will be a much different looking headlamp sub-harness onboard.

Dallara



~

 

[creggur]

Maybe I'm too devil-may-care about this, but I don't see how a single-point-of-failure problem that affects only one headlight on a dual-headlight system is a a significant safety risk. Annoying reliability risk, yes, but not a safety risk.

- Mark

You and I may not think it's a huge deal, but Yamaha knows there are a thousand lawyers lined up for the cause if just one accident can be attributed to such a failure. If you or your company have never been frivolously sued count yourself lucky. The cards are stacked against you going in, and even if you win the costs are enormous.