Cooked Headlamp Harness

[jajpko]

I thought that it would only be more flexible. If the same overall gauge, the resistance should be the same, IIRC.

Your probably right Rod.. Because it is silver coated I figured it might have less resistance. My thinking is the skin effect would not be the same on a coated wire.

 

[Tremor38]

Re: Re: Cooked Headlamp Harness

Your probably right Rod.. Because it is silver coated I figured it might have less resistance. My thinking is the skin effect would not be the same on a coated wire.

Seeing as how we're dealing with purely DC, I don't think skin effect is a factor. ;-)

 

[3putt]

Okay, another thing the ground wire is shared with a 2 wire connector that plugs into a device below the headlight. Does anyone know what that is? Not shown in the fiche for the parts blowup. The connector is shown (2 wire pins) but not the part it plugs into??

 

[Dallara]

Okay, another thing the ground wire is shared with a 2 wire connector that plugs into a device below the headlight. Does anyone know what that is? Not shown in the fiche for the parts blowup. The connector is shown (2 wire pins) but not the part it plugs into??

It's the connector to the solenoid that operates the "shutter" for the high-low beam function of the projector lamp. Just like quite a number of cars that use a nearly identical headlamp housing.

BTW, I'm working on a more complete solution, along with pics, I'll put up (hopefully) soon.

Great job on yours, Tiger One!!! ::012::

Dallara



~

 

[3putt]

Okay, will be watching for your solution. They made that little harness quite complicated. My left side all along has been perfect and still looks like new, just the right side that melted and then over heated the blade connector I later installed.

 

[Tremor38]

Okay, another thing the ground wire is shared with a 2 wire connector that plugs into a device below the headlight. Does anyone know what that is? Not shown in the fiche for the parts blowup. The connector is shown (2 wire pins) but not the part it plugs into??

Yeah, as Dallara said, it's for the hi/lo shutter solenoid. When I first saw the harness pullled out, I coudn't believe they they were sharing that whimpy little ground wire with the headlights...crazy stuff. Not as bad when you're just using flash to pass, but looking at the schematic, those solenoids stay energized while you're running in high beam....thats about 10A of steady current draw for both bulbs added together, plus whatever the soledoids draw, all on that anemic ground wire. Putting an ammeter on that circuit would be interesting.

 

[Dallara]

Yeah, as Dallara said, it's for the hi/lo shutter solenoid. When I first saw the harness pullled out, I coudn't believe they they were sharing that whimpy little ground wire with the headlights...crazy stuff. Not as bad when you're just using flash to pass, but looking at the schematic, those solenoids stay energized while you're running in high beam....thats about 10A of steady current draw for both bulbs added together, plus whatever the soledoids draw, all on that anemic ground wire. Putting an ammeter on that circuit would be interesting.

Al your observations mirror my own... And they all are why I am *POSITIVE* that not only has Yamaha realized there is a problem - hence the harnesses *NOT* being available for ordering - but that the new, replacement harnesses, when they arrive, will not only be quite a bit different as far as wire size, materials, and components (i.e. headlamp plugs), but will also have even a superseded part number. I also doubt next years Super Tenere will have the same headlamp harness we have now as standard!

Dallara



~

 

[Dallara]

~

BTW, and as a side note to this discussion of the headlamp harness...

I have discovered another issue you all might want to take a look at. As Tiger One mentioned, where the headlamp harness plugs into the main motorcycle harness there are three other plugs ganged in the same rubber "boot" that connect to various other functional components. As I am waiting on a couple of specific items for making my proposed repair/re-make of the headlamp harness I decided to check some various electrical connections for any possible signs of other components having heat or resistance related damage. Though so far I have *NOT* found any evidence or indication of such problems I *DID* find something else to be concerned about...

Corrosion inside connectors.

So far each and every electrical power plug I have pulled apart on the motorcycle has shown at least some evidence of corrosion. And I'm not exaggerating... Each and every one has shown some corrosion, though some it is almost incremental. Others, though, it is enough to cause real concern, and prompt me to take some action - i.e. properly cleaning, preparing, and then reassembling each connector with the appropriate contact cleaners and silicone dielectric grease compound. This may not seem to something to worry about, but I've only had my bike 4 months (7,000 miles), and it was produced in June 2011, and the amount of contact corrosion in that short of period of time is more than I want on my bike.

I should note a couple of things... I don't ride in the rain a lot, though I have some. I don't wash my bikes a lot, either, though my S-10 has had a couple of baths since new. However, I do live on the South Texas Gulf Coast, which just happens to be one of the most corrosive environments in the USA. Tons of humidity, and that moisture in the air is full of salt.

Still, I recommend you check *ALL* your plug-in connections on your Super Tenere, and while you're there give 'em a squirt or two of a quality contact cleaner like DeOxIt, then treat to some good silicone dielectric compound from Dow, CRC, Motorcraft, etc. Could go a long way in preventing electrical glitches and problems in your long-term future.

Just FYI...

Dallara



~

 

[3putt]

I cancelled my order for the harness and got a refund, was informed that the harness shipped from Yamaha yesterday. So if anyone is waiting for a new harness it should be in soon, wondering if there are any changes?

 

[Dallara]

~

If any of you are interested in some high-resolution pictures of the stock wiring harness and it's construction I have some up in a couple of my SmugMug galleries at the following URL's:

http://timetunnel.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/Super-Tenere-Headlamp-Harness/20442228_sftzx3#1617986040_9CScr5s

http://timetunnel.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/Super-Tenere-Harness-Gallery-2/20460468_FDpbLq#1619747614_5VrGJCR

http://timetunnel.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/Super-Tenere-Harness-Gallery-3/20473428_zhMnDg#1620913700_CQX6nmS

Note that all of these can be viewed *VERY* large by simply passing your mouse pointer over the preview pane pic and when the menu bar slides out from the right simply click on the size you want to see.

The pictures show the harness from as it came out of the bike to where I have pulled all the tape wrapping from the sections I plan to re-work. It's pretty easy to see how substandard the plug is, as well as how small the wire sizes down from where plugs into the main harness to where it is connected to the headlamp bulb. Honestly, I simply cannot believe how poorly designed and built it is, nor how such low-quality materials and components were used...

Completely out of the norm of my experience with Yamaha.

Hope these will help some of you.

Dallara



~

 

[jajpko]

~

If any of you are interested in some high-resolution pictures of the stock wiring harness and it's construction I have some up in a couple of my SmugMug galleries at the following URL's:

http://timetunnel.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/Super-Tenere-Headlamp-Harness/20442228_sftzx3#1617986040_9CScr5s

http://timetunnel.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/Super-Tenere-Harness-Gallery-2/20460468_FDpbLq#1619747614_5VrGJCR

Note that all of these can be viewed *VERY* large by simply passing your mouse pointer over the preview pane pic and when the menu bar slides out from the right simply click on the size you want to see.

The pictures show the harness from as it came out of the bike to where I have pulled all the tape wrapping from the sections I plan to re-work. It's pretty easy to see how substandard the plug is, as well as how small the wire sizes down from where plugs into the main harness to where it is connected to the headlamp bulb. Honestly, I simply cannot believe how poorly designed and built it is, nor how such low-quality materials and components were used...

Completely out of the norm of my experience with Yamaha.

Hope these will help some of you.

Dallara



~

Thanks for the nice pics. What wire are you using and where did you purchase it?
Also have you thought about using a relay for the H7s and using the OEM wire for a trigger?
I'm thinking of going this way.
Thanks

 

[stgreg]

Dallara, what watt bulbs caused that?

 

[Dallara]

Dallara, what watt bulbs caused that?

That's some 14-gauge Novak wire with high-temp silicone insulation shown in the pics. You can find it at most R/C (radio controlled) aircraft, helicopter, and car hobby shops. Years ago I fooled around some in R/C, and a lot in R/C electric oval car racing, and Novak's wire was the best I ever found for this kind of application even outside of R/C racing. It's extremely flexible, the insulation is able to withstand truly excessive amounts of heat, and the wire itself is some of the best silver-plated OFHC copper I've ever found. That quality wire is why it has such little resistance. It is used on electric R/C cars, aircraft, etc. at very, VERY high discharge rates from high amperage battery packs to the motors, and those discharge rates cause some extremely high heat... Heat that melts more mundane wire. That's why I'm using it - as more insurance against any future failure.

I'll have more on the wire, multi-wire jacketing, etc. once everything else I'm waiting on gets here and I actually re-make the harness. I'll try and do a step-by-step outline of what I did, with pictures, here in this thread once I'm done. Hopefully that will help anyone else who encounters the problem.

Of course, by then the replacement harness Yamaha is supposed to be sending me will probably be here!

I have no plans to re-wire the system to use an additional relay, etc. as you describe, Japako... Primarily because I don't think that's necessary. If I decide to that I will probably re-wire the whole thing and build the harness up to use HID ballasts/igniters, etc. and configure the bike to run HID bulbs in the projector housings.

Dallara, what watt bulbs caused that?

The stock, OEM 55-watt Phillips bulbs my Super Tenere came with. Those are the only bulbs I ever ran in it.

Dallara



~

 

[Tremor38]

Re: Re: Cooked Headlamp Harness

~

BTW, and as a side note to this discussion of the headlamp harness...

I have discovered another issue you all might want to take a look at. As Tiger One mentioned, where the headlamp harness plugs into the main motorcycle harness there are three other plugs ganged in the same rubber "boot" that connect to various other functional components. As I am waiting on a couple of specific items for making my proposed repair/re-make of the headlamp harness I decided to check some various electrical connections for any possible signs of other components having heat or resistance related damage. Though so far I have *NOT* found any evidence or indication of such problems I *DID* find something else to be concerned about...

Corrosion inside connectors.

So far each and every electrical power plug I have pulled apart on the motorcycle has shown at least some evidence of corrosion. And I'm not exaggerating... Each and every one has shown some corrosion, though some it is almost incremental. Others, though, it is enough to cause real concern, and prompt me to take some action - i.e. properly cleaning, preparing, and then reassembling each connector with the appropriate contact cleaners and silicone dielectric grease compound. This may not seem to something to worry about, but I've only had my bike 4 months (7,000 miles), and it was produced in June 2011, and the amount of contact corrosion in that short of period of time is more than I want on my bike.

I should note a couple of things... I don't ride in the rain a lot, though I have some. I don't wash my bikes a lot, either, though my S-10 has had a couple of baths since new. However, I do live on the South Texas Gulf Coast, which just happens to be one of the most corrosive environments in the USA. Tons of humidity, and that moisture in the air is full of salt.

Still, I recommend you check *ALL* your plug-in connections on your Super Tenere, and while you're there give 'em a squirt or two of a quality contact cleaner like DeOxIt, then treat to some good silicone dielectric compound from Dow, CRC, Motorcraft, etc. Could go a long way in preventing electrical glitches and problems in your long-term future.

Just FYI...

Dallara



~

+1. Very good advice...especially the part about finishing up with the sil dialectic compound. I remember back in the day we used "petrolatum technical" which was patrolium jelly-based. Silcone dialectric grease is far better though.

 

[Tremor38]

Re: Re: Cooked Headlamp Harness

Thanks for the nice pics. What wire are you using and where did you purchase it?
Also have you thought about using a relay for the H7s and using the OEM wire for a trigger?
I'm thinking of going this way.
Thanks

The wires going into and out of the OEM headlight relay look up to the task. The smaller wires for the headlight assembly is where the ploblem starts. No sense in having two headlight relays when just a section of the wiring is the problem. I could see doing it your way if this bike didn't already have a headlight relay...ie lights switched directly by a handle bar switch attached to a fairly long run of skimpy wires, but this isn't the case.

 

[jajpko]

Re: Re: Cooked Headlamp Harness

The wires going into and out of the OEM headlight relay look up to the task. The smaller wires for the headlight assembly is where the ploblem starts. No sense in having two headlight relays when just a section of the wiring is the problem. I could see doing it your way if this bike didn't already have a headlight relay...ie lights switched directly by a handle bar switch attached to a fairly long run of skimpy wires, but this isn't the case.

You have a good point.

 

[Dallara]

~

Thought I'd toss this in...

I'm still thinkin' and re-thinkin' exactly how I want to re-wire the current (no pun intended) melted harness. I know Yamaha is sending me another one, but I just think I can do it better. Having the new, replacement harness from Yamaha sitting in the bullpen enables me to try to truly improve on a couple of design flaws I see in the existing harness. My goals are as follows:

1.) To prevent and preclude any such failure in the future, especially out in the middle of nowhere.
2.) To reduce resistance as much as possible in the headlamp sub-harness.
3.) To simplify the harness as much as possible and eliminate as many wire junctions, solder joints, etc. as possible.
4.) To make the harness as heat resistant as possible while at the same time enabling it to dissipate heat easier.
5.) To make the harness as flexible as possible while maintaining all the above.
6.) To make the harness immune to any sort of short circuit.
7.) To make the harness impervious to wear or any sort of problem with rubbing or chaffing.
8.) To make the harness easy to reproduce so others can make similar changes should they need to.

Maybe I'm over-thinking the problem, but I hate to do stuff twice...

I'll be using the aforementioned silicone-insulated OFHC wire, the best connectors I feel I can get for the job, high-quality silver solder for the joints, braided flame-proof cable jacketing (for both wear resistance and improved airflow for cooling compared to the PVC jacketing used on the current harness), high-quality heat-shrink tubing, and the best 3M electrical tape I have around. Everything is here now, so I can start actually doing some of the work. However, I do have an inquiry into Jim Davis at Eastern Beaver to see if he can source me all the specialty Japanese plugs and connectors, and if he can supply those maybe I can make up an extra harness or two if someone else needs 'em!

If nothing else, the little project/problem/issue has become a bit of fun!

Dallara



~

 

[3putt]

If nothing else, the little project/problem/issue has become a bit of fun!

Dallara
~

Yep! +1

 

[Dallara]

~


Well, thought you folks might like an update in the continuing saga of the cooked headlamp harness...

Got a phone call today from my dealer, and low and behold the warranty replacement harness from Yamaha had arrived, and well ahead of schedule. I made sure I had time to swing by there before they closed this evening, and just for fun I took all of the pieces of the original melted harness I am rebuilding so we could compare them. I get there and they slap the new harness up on the counter in its nice, clear plastic bag from Yamaha, and imagine my surprise when I look at it and...

It's *EXACTLY* the same harness. No changes to the cheesy headlamp plugs. Wire sizes the same wimpy size. Nothing different.

Not much I can do about that. It's just that I really do have a ton of respect for Yamaha and how robust they build things, usually using very high-quality materials. It's just a shock to see them tip-toe so close to the edge with these pieces, and to me, quite out of character for them. Oh, well... Onward and upward!

On another note, I have exchanged several e-mails with Jim Davis at Eastern Beaver, and he was equally shocked to hear that Yamaha had scrimped so badly on the harness. He not only said the wire sizes were borderline at best, but also said the layout of the harness (he had access to many pictures I took) was unnecessarily complex. The bad news is that he had no idea where to get replacement plugs for the ones that connect to the solenoids, but the *sort of* good news was that he did have replacement plugs for the main white connector plug that joins the headlamp sub-harness to the main harness... If you're interested let me know and I'll post the link.

However, he said that plug was totally inadequate for the current to the headlamp bulbs. He said he had seen manufacturers use it that way before but that such use had always caused problems down the road. He said that since it was easy to get to both sides of that connector plug why not just replace it - both the male and female side - with a better connector, and then use the better wire and H7 headlamp connector plugs I had. Splicing in the marker bulbs would be no problem, and since the solenoid plugs carry little actual load I could simply splice them in with their smaller wire, too. He felt that would eliminate all problems in the future, and since I could still source the original style OEM Yamaha plug I could always go back if it was necessary for some warranty reason, etc.

Makes some good sense, and if anyone is interested in his recommended replacement plug I can post that link, too.

I can't ride right now so I have some time to work on this a bit more. As it sits because I can't get all the necessary plugs I won't be able to build up complete replacement harnesses, but once I get it sorted out I may be able to offer to modify people's harness if they don't want to tackle it themselves.

Just thought I'd keep the info updated, but make note, currently if you order a new harness from Yamaha, or you have the problem and they warranty it you should know you will be getting the same, exact, borderline design and materials as what is currently on there.

Dallara


~

 

[Tremor38]

Re: Re: Cooked Headlamp Harness

~


Well, thought you folks might like an update in the continuing saga of the cooked headlamp harness...

Got a phone call today from my dealer, and low and behold the warranty replacement harness from Yamaha had arrived, and well ahead of schedule. I made sure I had time to swing by there before they closed this evening, and just for fun I took all of the pieces of the original melted harness I am rebuilding so we could compare them. I get there and they slap the new harness up on the counter in its nice, clear plastic bag from Yamaha, and imagine my surprise when I look at it and...

It's *EXACTLY* the same harness. No changes to the cheesy headlamp plugs. Wire sizes the same wimpy size. Nothing different.

Not much I can do about that. It's just that I really do have a ton of respect for Yamaha and how robust they build things, usually using very high-quality materials. It's just a shock to see them tip-toe so close to the edge with these pieces, and to me, quite out of character for them. Oh, well... Onward and upward!

On another note, I have exchanged several e-mails with Jim Davis at Eastern Beaver, and he was equally shocked to hear that Yamaha had scrimped so badly on the harness. He not only said the wire sizes were borderline at best, but also said the layout of the harness (he had access to many pictures I took) was unnecessarily complex. The bad news is that he had no idea where to get replacement plugs for the ones that connect to the solenoids, but the *sort of* good news was that he did have replacement plugs for the main white connector plug that joins the headlamp sub-harness to the main harness... If you're interested let me know and I'll post the link.

However, he said that plug was totally inadequate for the current to the headlamp bulbs. He said he had seen manufacturers use it that way before but that such use had always caused problems down the road. He said that since it was easy to get to both sides of that connector plug why not just replace it - both the male and female side - with a better connector, and then use the better wire and H7 headlamp connector plugs I had. Splicing in the marker bulbs would be no problem, and since the solenoid plugs carry little actual load I could simply splice them in with their smaller wire, too. He felt that would eliminate all problems in the future, and since I could still source the original style OEM Yamaha plug I could always go back if it was necessary for some warranty reason, etc.

Makes some good sense, and if anyone is interested in his recommended replacement plug I can post that link, too.

I can't ride right now so I have some time to work on this a bit more. As it sits because I can't get all the necessary plugs I won't be able to build up complete replacement harnesses, but once I get it sorted out I may be able to offer to modify people's harness if they don't want to tackle it themselves.

Just thought I'd keep the info updated, but make note, currently if you order a new harness from Yamaha, or you have the problem and they warranty it you should know you will be getting the same, exact, borderline design and materials as what is currently on there.

Dallara


~

Thanks for the update. If you can post the link to Jim's recommended connector, that would be great. That way he won't have to answer a gaggle of emails (including mine)requesting the same info.

Thanks again.