Who will be changing there chain tensioner to the 14' during valve adjustment ?
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Don in Lodi
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Let 'em sing! ::26::twinrider said:
Mzee
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Is it good to change just the cam chain tensioner or change the entire system: @ http://www.yamahasportsplaza.com/oemparts/a/yam/5004d83ef87002275461de68/camshaft-chain
10 Chain (98Xrh2015-150M) 94591-61150-00, 22.4$
11 Tensioner Assy, Cam Chain 2BS-12210-00-00, 130$
12 Gasket, Tensioner Case, 14B-12213-00-00 4.89 $
13 Bolt 91317-06025-00 (2) 1.48$
14 Damper, Chain, 1, 23P-12251-00-00, 16.06$
15 Damper, Chain 2, 23P-12252-00-00, 38.
10 Chain (98Xrh2015-150M) 94591-61150-00, 22.4$
11 Tensioner Assy, Cam Chain 2BS-12210-00-00, 130$
12 Gasket, Tensioner Case, 14B-12213-00-00 4.89 $
13 Bolt 91317-06025-00 (2) 1.48$
14 Damper, Chain, 1, 23P-12251-00-00, 16.06$
15 Damper, Chain 2, 23P-12252-00-00, 38.
EricV
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Well, it will be interesting to see what gets installed on my bike when the dealer fixes it. 82k, finished up an 8k mile Alaska trip, washed the bike, (yeah, I know), and changed the oil/filter.
The cam chain had been getting pretty noisy on the last half of the trip. MPG had dropped into the mid 30's and I was a little over due for the 3rd valve adjustment period. I had made an appointment at the local dealer to have the valves checked and to have them look at the cam chain tensioner. Bike fired right away, then there was a 'bad noise' and it died. Sort of the engine lighting off, then an immediate snap sound and it died before fully coming to life. I foolishly tried to crank it a couple more times, thinking maybe I didn't hear what I thought I heard and it was just the not so uncommon flooded hard start issue, so typical after a wash. Opps, back fired badly. (Later I found out from the shop that it blew the TBs off the intake manifold.)
Initial diagnosis is slipped a tooth on the cam gear, but they also noticed what appears to be an intake valve not fully closing and half of one piston is very lean. Leak down and compression tests indicate one cylinder rather bad off, but I haven't heard what they found after they got approval from Yamaha to tear it down more. I have the 4 year extended Yes, bike is a '12. No issues up to this point.
Time will tell.
The cam chain had been getting pretty noisy on the last half of the trip. MPG had dropped into the mid 30's and I was a little over due for the 3rd valve adjustment period. I had made an appointment at the local dealer to have the valves checked and to have them look at the cam chain tensioner. Bike fired right away, then there was a 'bad noise' and it died. Sort of the engine lighting off, then an immediate snap sound and it died before fully coming to life. I foolishly tried to crank it a couple more times, thinking maybe I didn't hear what I thought I heard and it was just the not so uncommon flooded hard start issue, so typical after a wash. Opps, back fired badly. (Later I found out from the shop that it blew the TBs off the intake manifold.)
Initial diagnosis is slipped a tooth on the cam gear, but they also noticed what appears to be an intake valve not fully closing and half of one piston is very lean. Leak down and compression tests indicate one cylinder rather bad off, but I haven't heard what they found after they got approval from Yamaha to tear it down more. I have the 4 year extended Yes, bike is a '12. No issues up to this point.
Time will tell.
Koinz
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Good thing you were home when it let go.EricV said:
Way to hide a catastrophic failure deep in an existing post!EricV said:
I wish you luck!
Definitely keep us posted. The parts they will be replacing are not cheap. If a new cam chain is needed at 52k I just assume change it then rather than wait for this failure!
ac
EricV
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82k, and until it's known exactly what happened, I'm not willing to label it catastrophic. It's not the cam chain that is likely the issue, but the tensioner, thus the post in this thread. There have been other tensioner replacements, it's my bad luck that when I noticed it getting noisy, I wasn't in a location where it was possible to get it looked at. I suspect the oil change may have been a contributing factor, in terms of lack of oil pressure for just a tad longer than on a normal start up. I agree that if this goes beyond head work, it's going to be expensive. And I'm real curious to hear what they find with the valve they think had been sticking open.avc8130 said:
Typically Yamaha supersedes part numbers. The clutch basket still shows two part numbers in the parts system, but the cam chain tensioner shows the 2BS-12210-00-00 as superseding the old 23P-12210-00-00 number when looking up the 2012 part number. I think that answers the questions in this thread about what part would be used for any repairs.
And yes, it's very good that this didn't happen when I was in some remote area of the Yukon or Alaska. That would have really, really sucked. One fellow on the Top of the World Hwy got towed and it cost $5/kilometer, plus hook up fee. I think he was somewhere around 60k in and don't know where he ultimately needed to be towed to. Nothing in Chicken, so probably Dawson City, YT, but getting repairs there might not have been possible.
When I have more of the story, and know how Yamaha is going to handle it, I'll start a thread on it. Until then, there is simply not enough info to bother with a discussion. Most people would have had plenty of warning and time to get it checked out before it got to the point mine did. I wear ear plugs 100% of the time while riding too, so it's possible I simple didn't notice the noise when it wasn't as loud. After all, the S10 is a noisy bike on start up, even when new.
Mine makes a heck of a racket when first started, but calms down relatively quickly.
At the 52k check, assuming I have no problems sooner, I will definitely be swapping the tensioner for either the latest/greatest from Yamaha or a straight mechanical tensioner.
Good luck and let us know what they find! Even "just" head work is ~$1k on this motor.
ac
At the 52k check, assuming I have no problems sooner, I will definitely be swapping the tensioner for either the latest/greatest from Yamaha or a straight mechanical tensioner.
Good luck and let us know what they find! Even "just" head work is ~$1k on this motor.
ac
EricV
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Yes, mine was always noisy on start up too, but quickly quieted down. I suspect that if I had been at a dealer for the 78k valve clearance check, I would not have suffered the chain skip, but still might have been looking at a tear down for the unrelated valve issue. That extra 4k may have just been <this much> too far.avc8130 said:
Yamaha had some cam chain tensioner issues on the FJRs too, so it surprises me that they haven't figured out how to keep a CCT working at this point. The 'new' CCT for the FJRs works great and seldom has issues. I'm hoping that for all our sakes, the 'new' CCT for the Super Ten is the same, and no more issues are encountered for the '14 on riders. The rest of us will just have to deal with the potential issue like you are, with a preemptive change or a better awareness of the problem before it gets too bad. I went thru 3 CCTs on the '04 FJR. 55k, 68k and 98k. The last was of the new design and still quiet at 162k when I sold the bike. On the FJR, it could get really loud before you were in any serious danger. Apparently not so on the Super Ten.
As stated, I'll start a new thread when I know what happened, and how Yamaha is going to handle it. I'm confident that they will handle it under warranty, and that the dealer will work for me to get it all handled.
Eric,EricV said:Yes, mine was always noisy on start up too, but quickly quieted down. I suspect that if I had been at a dealer for the 78k valve clearance check, I would not have suffered the chain skip, but still might have been looking at a tear down for the unrelated valve issue. That extra 4k may have just been <this much> too far.
Yamaha had some cam chain tensioner issues on the FJRs too, so it surprises me that they haven't figured out how to keep a CCT working at this point. The 'new' CCT for the FJRs works great and seldom has issues. I'm hoping that for all our sakes, the 'new' CCT for the Super Ten is the same, and no more issues are encountered for the '14 on riders. The rest of us will just have to deal with the potential issue like you are, with a preemptive change or a better awareness of the problem before it gets too bad. I went thru 3 CCTs on the '04 FJR. 55k, 68k and 98k. The last was of the new design and still quiet at 162k when I sold the bike. On the FJR, it could get really loud before you were in any serious danger. Apparently not so on the Super Ten.
As stated, I'll start a new thread when I know what happened, and how Yamaha is going to handle it. I'm confident that they will handle it under warranty, and that the dealer will work for me to get it all handled.
Any update?
My 2012 is pretty loud at startup and I'm debating if I should swap to the 14 tensioner.
ac
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avc8130 said:
I saw that... I'm only guessing they are a hair longer or shorter... For the cost, I would just grab them...
EricV
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Stopped by last Sat, they were waiting on Yamaha to approve the parts list they submitted, which included pistons, cylinders, CCT, cam chain, and I think a full head. I haven't heard if it all got approved yet. They estimated 2 weeks to have the bike back up and running once approval was given.avc8130 said:
I would suggest that you go with the updated design, or if you're under warranty, take it down and complain about the noise on start ups and see what they do. I know a few people that have done the manual CCT, and as long as you pay attention and adjust it as needed, it's fine. But a lack of diligence will bite you too.
Bernie has changed his already to the new style. He ordered the new cap screws, the only difference he could see was the colour ( black instead of cad plated or the other way around) same dimensions as originals. He's travelling today or he would have chimed in I'm sure.avc8130 said:
Koinz
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I had my cam replaced under the yes warranty. I specifically asked for the updated tensioner for the '12 model. Don't know if it's the same as the '14, but its been quite on startup for about 4k miles. The old one didn't start rattling until the bike had a lot more miles than that.
MGB
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Interesting note, I felt like I was getting more cam chain noise on start up the last few thousand miles (currently at 22K). Did my valve adjustment which of course included resetting the tensioner, I've started it about 15 times since then (doing TB synch, etc) and I don't notice the noise.
If I start getting noise, I'm going to replace it - cheap insurance (assuming, as someone pointed out in this thread, the '14 is an actual improvement).
If I start getting noise, I'm going to replace it - cheap insurance (assuming, as someone pointed out in this thread, the '14 is an actual improvement).
Well your dealer isn't being 100% honest.twinrider said:
If your valves are "ok", then they are somewhat correct in that the cam chain tensioner would not be touched. However a bunch of the labor to move the gas tank and other parts to access the area is common.
If your valves need adjustment, the cam chain tensioner must be removed/reinstalled anyways.
ac