SpeedStar
XT12 and DL650
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Jim, that is great news! It only gets better as you get it dialed in with AT.
Vibrations and Dyna PCV / Arrow header/ Leo Vince can/
- Thread starter jajpko
- Start date
Well, then it definitely wasn't youspasm said:
I think the forum name started with 'WRW' followed by some numbers. Come-out, come out, wherever you are! >
Ok, first report... Went riding the other night and when I returned the idle was jumping quit a bit. Shut it off and the next day it was fine. Has been since.~TABASCO~ said:
Went on a two hundred mile ride today and the bike ran well. I did take it easy on the throttle and my mileage was down to 40.4. I will take a look at the map tomorrow, could be the cold weather and a little wind.
Other than that running great. ;D
~TABASCO~
RIDE ON ADV is what I do !
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The idle down low was learning when it moves like that.. If you like you can go in and change those "cells" at 1100 a little........ Mine did move like that at first and now it perrrrrrrr's like a gold wing...... If you have any questions with the down load or maps just give me a call ! ! !
If you have any questions with the down load or maps just give me a call ! ! !
What are the trim values in those cells? Have you accepted the trim values already? What change % have you set in the AT settings?japako said:
i dont understand this trim value thing, WHY does it need to be changed ????? mines at 20%, the bike is running really well, and im still having trouble trying to post my map, its doing my head in lol
Spasm,spasm said:
Read this: http://www.powercommander.com/downloads/Support-Released/AutoTune/Manuals/IAT-200.02.pdf and read it thoroughly...
Especially this section:
Most maps from Dynojet will include a base Target AFR table.
These settings are intended to deliver optimal performance while still maintaining decent fuel mileage in the cruise area (for most models).
To alter the AFR target click on Target AFR in the tree view. Expand each cylinder and/or gear if necessary to view the corresponding table.
If necessary type in different values in the cells. Multiple cells can be highlighted by using click/drag with the mouse.
• It is recommended to load a base map into the PCV that best corresponds to your bikes current configuration. This will decrease the time in which it takes for the Autotune module to achieve its target air/fuel.
• A switch can be wired into the PCV to be used to toggle between your base map and learning mode. Any SPST (open/close) type switch can be used. When the switch is OPEN the PCV will be running on the base map. When the switch is CLOSED the PCV will go into learn mode and Autotune will start making fuel trim adjustments.
You can toggle between these modes at any time. The values learned for the fuel trims will be saved if you toggle back to the base map.
• After a riding session you can view the Trim table by clicking on the respective table in the tree view and clicking GET TABLE. To accept these trims and transfer them into the Fuel map [size=14pt]click on Auto Tune - accept trims.[/size] This will zero out the trim table(s) and add the trim values to the base map(s).
The PCV is configured to only allow the software to trim +/- 20% until you manually accept the trims. You can alter these limits in the Auto Tune configuration. The more the PCV learns the lower you can make this value. By lowering this value it will work as a safety net so if something should go wrong in the unit or bike it will not cause the bike to run poorly.
***********************************************************************************************************************
You have high-tech gear installed but you obviously do not (know how to) use it.
You need a WINDOWS laptop!!!!
Get a WINDOWS laptop and hook it up to the PC V. Without a Windows PC you will NOT be able to use the PC V / AT functionality. I (and others) have told you this before... like here: http://www.yamahasupertenere.com/index.php?topic=2247.msg44423#msg44423
Or, call your tuner and have them explain to you how to use the AT module if you do not care to read the manual / our advise.
So the basic procedure is:
1. Ride the bike
2. Hook-up a windows laptop (with the PC V Control Center Software running) to the PC V
3. Get the trimtables
4. Accept the trim tables
5. Goto 1.
That way the AT will hone in the trimvalues untill the trimvalues are minor, while you accept the trimvalues and feed them back into the Fuel Map, which leads to a map that is optimal.
You can build your own target AFR Map(s), based on your requirements, for example either optimal fuel economy, or maximum power.. or any mix...
But either way, you will need a Windows laptop in order to start using the functionality of the PC V and AT at hand.
Also, it will allow you to better grasp the functionality and the above usage guide/desciptions.
Hope this clears things up for you.
p.s. let's try not to clog up this topic with "how to use the PC V" desciptions, let's (ab)use ~TABASCO~'s http://www.yamahasupertenere.com/index.php?topic=2247.0 topic for that....
thanks for the help, you have email, and a message
Spasm,spasm said:
You have two emails back. In essence: hook up a windows laptop to your PC V and accept the trimvalues. Otherwise you have only ONE iteration of AT trim values, and that's it.... AT wil continously and incrementally optimize your fuel map ONLY when you hook up the windows PC and ACCEPT the trim values.
Now you only have had ONE optimization pass, and further incremental optimization is inhibited due to the fact that you do not accept these trim values....
Did you hook up a PC and accept the trim values? yes or no?
If no, you might as well throw the AT out of the window.
i have accepted the trim values
Great! Finally some directions on where you stand.
Please note, that you can only get and accept the actual trim values (if the trim map is populated with trim values other than 0) while your PC is connected to the PC V!
Now if you do this after each longer ride you'll hone in the map based on your Target AF values.
Have you seen other values than 0 in the Trim table after a ride? Or have you never hooked up the PC/laptop to the PC V?
How many times have you driven the bike and afterwards accepted the trim values? (how many iteration passes have you applied?)
You can make your own AF Target table to suit your needs.
Now what is it that you do not understand regarding the Max enrichment Trim / Max enleanment Trim?
The PCV is configured to only allow the software to trim +/- 20% until you manually accept the trims. You can alter these limits in the Auto Tune configuration. The more the PCV learns the lower you can make this value. By lowering this value it will work as a safety net so if something should go wrong in the unit or bike it will not cause the bike to run poorly.
Please note, that you can only get and accept the actual trim values (if the trim map is populated with trim values other than 0) while your PC is connected to the PC V!
Now if you do this after each longer ride you'll hone in the map based on your Target AF values.
Have you seen other values than 0 in the Trim table after a ride? Or have you never hooked up the PC/laptop to the PC V?
How many times have you driven the bike and afterwards accepted the trim values? (how many iteration passes have you applied?)
You can make your own AF Target table to suit your needs.
Now what is it that you do not understand regarding the Max enrichment Trim / Max enleanment Trim?
The PCV is configured to only allow the software to trim +/- 20% until you manually accept the trims. You can alter these limits in the Auto Tune configuration. The more the PCV learns the lower you can make this value. By lowering this value it will work as a safety net so if something should go wrong in the unit or bike it will not cause the bike to run poorly.
Attachments
CAn you post a picture showing the Trim values after you have driven the bike for a while?
None of the pics actually show the trim map. (in the left colomn, the word TRIM in the tree should be green).
None of the pics actually show the trim map. (in the left colomn, the word TRIM in the tree should be green).
here
i have set the trim down to 15% on both
i have set the trim down to 15% on both
the reason im asking so many questions is the guys that fitted my pcv and set it up said i dont need to do anything else just leave it alone ??????
but i see on here that everyone is playing around and changing settings, accepting trims, changing AFR settings. these are things i dont understand much about?
but i see on here that everyone is playing around and changing settings, accepting trims, changing AFR settings. these are things i dont understand much about?
Kewl!
So, you now are in control!
How many iteration passes did you go through already?
The trim values should gradually get lower and lower as the Fuel map hones in.
Good to see you are getting the grips on things!
So, you now are in control!
How many iteration passes did you go through already?
The trim values should gradually get lower and lower as the Fuel map hones in.
Good to see you are getting the grips on things!
They deserve a firm kick in the nuts! ::009:: >spasm said:
As you will now understand, you make a TARGET AFR Table which sets your bike up for economy or power mode. (lean/rich fuel settings per throttle % and rpms)
Then AT will trim the AF amounts (Populate the TRIM Table with trim values).
Which YOU feed into the FUEL Table by ACCEPT TRIM.
After so many iterations (accepting the trim values) the trim values will reduce (become 0 ore close to 0), hence, the bike runs at the exact TARGET AFR VALUES that are in the TARGET AFR Table.
THAT is the moment in time from when on, you will NOT NEED to do anything else, just leave it alone..... ::012::
After this, the trim values will only change slightly due to EXTERNAL conditions (Fuel quality, ambient temperature, altitude), and these minor trim values are continously updating the now optimal FUEL Table.
Hope this clears things up!
So, you have THREE Tables to work with:
TARGET AFR Table (the AF ratio goal that you want your bike to run at. This map you can edit yourself based on how you want your bike to run)
TRIM Table (being continously populated by values by AT)
FUEL Table (is being populated/corrected when you accept the trim values, or manually by you).
These (all tables dependant on the number of add-on modules installed) three tables together are called the MAP.
So let's say you have a TARGET AFR of 13 in the cell for 60% throttle and at 5000 rpm of the TARGET AFR Table
Trim value for that cell after riding the bike is set to 10 in the TRIM Table by AutoTune
The FUEL Table for that cell initially contains 0. After accepting the trim values that AT generated for you while driving, the FUEL Table for that cell would contain 10. Meaning the PC V will add 10% of fuel at 60% throttle and 5000 rpm in order to achieve the TARGET AFR of 13 that you've set for that cell.
Now after the next ride, let's say AutoTune put a -4 into that cell of the TRIM Table. After you accept this trim value by using ACCEPT TRIM, the value in the FUEL Table for that cell would change from 10 to 6 (deducting 4 from 10). That is the way that the AT module continuously improves your FUEL Table. Once the TRIM Values in the TRIM Table are all 0 or close to 0 you have reached your goal. The PC V is adjusting the actual AFR to match the exact AFR values that you have eneterd into the AFR TARGET Table.
And AutoTune will continuously adjust the trim values (within the % bandwith that you setup in the Max % enrichment / Max % enleanment option of the AutoTune Configuration) caused by the external variables to make sure the PC V is able to meet the AFR TARGET values.
The base TARGET AFR Table that Dynojet provides can be edited by you. The FUEL Table that your tuner made on the dyno is a good starting point for the FUEL Table. As you drive more and after each ride accept the trim values, you will notice that the bike runs better after each run / acceptance of the trim values!
I have not done anything yet. Yesterday was the first good ride. I will accept the trim values today and start over.Blue_eyes said:
Without looking I think the % is at 20
I won't know the trim values until I look at this later this morning.
Sorry japako, my question was aimed at Spasm...japako said:
I abused your topic to explain to Spasm how PC V and AT work and how to use it.... My apologies for that!
I hope others find it useful too.
It would be nice to hear more about the trim values you see. It's such a nice process to see the trim values close in, play with the PC V maps (if you're into farkling as I am...) ::025::
so basically, all i do is after every good ride, is check my trim changes, accept them, and as they get close to 0 close my trim values down to maybe 10%, see the dynojet instructions are very limited on info, relying on fitters/ tuners maybe. maybe a new thread with step by step instructions fron the guys like tabasco and co would be of great help to us that dont know ::022::