Something's Wrong... Valve Clearances Questions

[Jdomperez]

Can someone please look at these valve caps (in blue)
and tell me l'm not wrong.. The pickup rotor mark "k" is
aligned with the "mating surface" as specified within the tech
manual (PG. 3-6). But the exhaust valve lifters on cylinder #1
(left side) aren't totally lifted as the others, is this normal?
Currently conducting the the dreaded valve clearance check, 4 valve and clearance intake check, readings
got exhaust readings of .20/.18/.20/.20 and intake
of .10/.13/.13/.10. so I removed the camshaft caps and
adjusted only exhaust as they were all slightly loose and
out of spec, so I brought them all to middle (placed four
new lifter pads (shims). Once 1 reinstalled everything,
got everything back in position to recheck clearance and
can't get the valves/cam lobes to line up properly. Is it what
dread, chain shifted and lobes are now "firing" on wrong
times?

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[holligl]

Did you ensure cams where in the proper location when reinstalling, and was the chain zip tied to the cams before releasing the CCT?

If you rotate crank 360° does the cam look correct? Cams rotate half as fast as the crankshaft, so you may be on the wrong rotation. I think that is noted in the manual.

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[Jlq1969]

Thus, from afar...and in general terms, both cams are on track...the cylinder (marked blue) is about to exit the exhaust phase...and the same cylinder is about to enter the intake phase...but a small error in degrees is enough to break…..because we can't know from above where the piston is..

 

[Jdomperez]

I'll attach before (whilst ziptied and chalked) and after pics to help. Close up pic is before (zip is attached in three places in fact) straight on is after. It was only after rotating from "k" turning 360 to get back to "T" marking that I saw that the exhaust on cylinder #1 was rising and falling differently. And when I have #1 "TDC" that the exhaust isn't itself TDC. This is what's causing me to pause.

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[~TABASCO~]

Do you have a service manual ?
There is an indication hole on the intake cam
You can always double check final work with the two “horizon” whiteness marks on each cam sprocket. If those two are not ‘horizontal’ to the case, there is an issue. (This is measured from the correct starting point with the indicator hole located in the intake cam)

To add to this just a little more specific, even if the witness marks appear to be in line with the case, but your one tooth off on the sprocket, it might look "horizontal" to the case BUT IT IS NOT.... One tooth off is HUGE, but it's not a huge difference on the horizontal witness marks on the cam sprockets. Have an eagle eye, and check and re check 5 times........

*** also note, make sure the cam chain has not fallen off the pads and fell against the case. The mechanic needs to physically look with a flash light to make sure its on center (both sides)... If it happens to fall to the side, the CCT / MCCT will "act" correct until you start the motor and very quickly the case is ruined. Must double-double check this....... and then check again.



NOTE: if you are out of phase by much, let alone 120*... and the motor was started.... (and wont run)... you might have a few bent valves..... just something to double check...

 

[Cycledude]

That’s why I never attempted to check the valves myself, even though it’s crazy expensive I’m willing to pay someone much more experienced to do it.

 

[Quaap]

I'll attach before (whilst ziptied and chalked) and after pics to help. Close up pic is before (zip is attached in three places in fact) straight on is after. It was only after rotating from "k" turning 360 to get back to "T" marking that I saw that the exhaust on cylinder #1 was rising and falling differently. And when I have #1 "TDC" that the exhaust isn't itself TDC. This is what's causing me to pause.

I don't understand this picture. You said you ziptied the cams. But here clearly one is loose. So, this one could already be off timing.
Also with a four stroke engine you need 2 revolutions (720 degrees) for a complete cycle. Meaning that the K mark can be 360 degrees off. Did you only line up the K mark, or did you also check the lobes of the camshaft as per manual?

 

[Jdomperez]

This was the intended photo, my bad

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[Jdomperez]

I don't understand this picture. You said you ziptied the cams. But here clearly one is loose. So, this one could already be off timing.
Also with a four stroke engine you need 2 revolutions (720 degrees) for a complete cycle. Meaning that the K mark can be 360 degrees off. Did you only line up the K mark, or did you also check the lobes of the camshaft as per manual?

The answer to ask your questions is yes, per manual rotations, it must be in "k" for Cam removal. I followed the manual and other users (here and other forums) instructions exactly. I think my issue was after I installed the new manual cam tensioner (Graves), that a link on the exhaust side wasn't lining up and I moved it to allow for the intake cam to finally line back up. Once I reinstalled and tried to check clearances again is where I met this issue.
Hope this makes better sense.

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[Jdomperez]

I believe I've found what's happened, looking to see what I can do to correct the action before I go in and tear it apart and I'm not right...the marks are not lined and it caused the intake to be off about 70+° (see attached photo) I'm getting this from the intake hole "f" and marker "g" not bring in alignment to the point that when I try to put it in "k" it ends up in "t" (when I have F align with g, it's perfectly in "t") and the lobe positions are incorrect (see photo).

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[~TABASCO~]

You can quickly check everything with the intake “indicating hole”……

And the two hash marks on the outside of each timing sprocket. They run horizontal to the case…..

 

[Jdomperez]

Do you mean, remove everything, and return it to these original positions and I should be back in alignment, given my marks are still present as well?

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[~TABASCO~]

Do you mean, remove everything, and return it to these original positions and I should be back in alignment, given my marks are still present as well?

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There are three points to double check:

Crank position - rotor, attached to crank
Intake cam position - pin hole position mark
Exhaust cam position - sprocket hash mark

And then with each of these you can check and double check everything is in ‘sync’ properly.

I forgot to mark the chain once and replaced a chain. In this case you have to start from scratch and check everything 3 times.

Please double check or confirm. If one of your cams was 180* out……. Did you turn the motor over. Did you try and start it, even once?
If so, you probably bent a valve(s) and that will need to be addressed first, before moving forward. Otherwise your wasting time…..