GPS on the Motorcycle - Mapquest Routes

[keeponriding]

Over the last 6 months. we've had a couple of GPS related discussions....some prompted by me, considering making the plunge (I bought a used car a few years ago that came with one and realized then how much I like them).

Anyway, after pondering thoughts and recommendations, I made the jump and bought the Nuvi 550; The Zumo was more than I wanted to spend...and I was able to get a reconditioned Nuvi (which is waterproof) for $175....mount another $25....so for $200, not bad.

I've used it now for a couple of weeks: I like it over maps as the unit is in my line of sight of the road, something I didn't like with maps looking down at the tank. I don't like losing the richness of distance one gets with a map, and I could adjust to that. The Nuvi touchscreen does respond to gloves...important, but I found the entry of custom routes to be tedious, to say the least (and the unit wants to force me to go over freeways, when there are wonderful two lanes; And take two lanes, when there are wonderful freeways).

However...after much trial and error, I found you can create a route in MapQuest (not supported in Google Maps), send it to the GPS; On the GPS, you can then import the data file as a custom route. The technique is not documented in the user guide and you have to go searching for a help file to explain it and once you do it, it is quite easy.

With that new found skill...I'm completely sold on the value of the tool.

 

[pqsqac]

My wife and I picked up a Garmin Nuvi 1300LM for our truck and I adapted it for use on the bike. Works great and only 120 at Wally World.

 

[Venture]

I too have a Nuvi 550. Can you explain more about how you do the import from Mapquest? The best I'd found to date was the ability to import waypoints, and then custom assemble them into a route right on the GPS. I'm going to try figure it out, but in the meantime if you see this post some more info if you can.

I was playing with the newer units at Costco, and I must say I'm actually quite jealous of how much faster the newer units render the maps. The Nuvi is kind of painful in that regard. Plus the 5" screens really make a difference.

 

[Kevhunts]

However...after much trial and error, I found you can create a route in MapQuest (not supported in Google Maps), send it to the GPS; On the GPS, you can then import the data file as a custom route. The technique is not documented in the user guide and you have to go searching for a help file to explain it and once you do it, it is quite easy.

With that new found skill...I'm completely sold on the value of the tool.

Have you tried Garmin's Mapsource program?
http://www8.garmin.com/support/download_details.jsp?id=209

 

[keeponriding]

Venture - instructions on MapQuest integration here: https://support.garmin.com/support/searchSupport/case.faces?caseId={34b70a30-12e3-11dd-dc9c-000000000000}

Kevhunts - for whatever reason, I can't install Mapsource as it requires a prior version...nice bit of Catch 22;

I agree the 550 is kind of slow, but I wanted to try it out first to see if I liked it before investing too much money. Considering my investment, and now that I found my ability to integrate with a PC mapping program, I'm very pleased with it.

 

[Venture]

Kevhunts - for whatever reason, I can't install Mapsource as it requires a prior version...nice bit of Catch 22;

::026:: Mapsource to me is like a unicorn - I've heard all about it, but never have been able to find where to buy it, how to install it, etc. I've tried several times and never managed to get it.

 

[keeponriding]

More on Mapquest integration (which seems to work fine, so not sure how much more value Mapsource is).

The GPS will recalculate routes...so if you modify the Mapquest route from point a to point b by "pulling" the route to a different road, the GPS will recalculate and may override your designed route using internal settings. I select towns along the way (I guess Waypoints?) to force the GPS to follow the route I defined, over creating a new one. My frustration is the GPS does not realize I want to take a two lane sometimes, over the freeway that may be faster and more direct....and sometimes prefer to take a freeway, in spite of direct two lanes.

 

[Venture]

More on Mapquest integration (which seems to work fine, so not sure how much more value Mapsource is).

The GPS will recalculate routes...so if you modify the Mapquest route from point a to point b by "pulling" the route to a different road, the GPS will recalculate and may override your designed route using internal settings. I select towns along the way (I guess Waypoints?) to force the GPS to follow the route I defined, over creating a new one. My frustration is the GPS does not realize I want to take a two lane sometimes, over the freeway that may be faster and more direct....and sometimes prefer to take a freeway, in spite of direct two lanes.

Have you tried setting the "highways" avoidance on the GPS? Also, "shortest distance" preference will generally keep you away from highways, but watch out for really terrible roads if you do that.

 

[keeponriding]

Yeah...I've also tried "scooter"...The GPS does not understand I want a mix of roads...it will either route direct, on freeways or on two lanes through boring country.

Example, I'm planning a 600 mile ride (day one) from Louisville to Elkins WV this weekend; It's 350 miles by freeway, the most direct route....the way I want to, the first 120 miles is four lane, interstate and a pretty mountain parkway; then south 100 miles, then east 50 then north 200. The route I want to take combines four lane, two lane, in some cases a direct route, in some cases indirect;

In other words, I have to enter my route...hence, the demand for Mapquest or some other interface where I can easily plug in my waypoints forcing the route I want to take, combining all types of roads.

 

[Venture]

Yeah...I've also tried "scooter"...The GPS does not understand I want a mix of roads...it will either route direct, on freeways or on two lanes through boring country.

Example, I'm planning a 600 mile ride (day one) from Louisville to Elkins WV this weekend; It's 350 miles by freeway, the most direct route....the way I want to, the first 120 miles is four lane, interstate and a pretty mountain parkway; then south 100 miles, then east 50 then north 200. The route I want to take combines four lane, two lane, in some cases a direct route, in some cases indirect;

In other words, I have to enter my route...hence, the demand for Mapquest or some other interface where I can easily plug in my waypoints forcing the route I want to take, combining all types of roads.

What you're describing is pretty much my experience as well. It's my major gripe about these GPSes, you can't seem to import the EXACT ROUTE you want to take, just some waypoints that generalize it. A friend of mine told me Google Maps on Android now has a feature to allow you to navigate via a custom map, which sounds like exactly what I'm looking for, but I haven't tried it out yet.

 

[keeponriding]

It's our "deficiency" as motorcyclists; Sometimes we want to get their fastest way, sometimes prettiest, sometimes the most direct, sometimes the least. Not a problem in my car, I just want to get where I'm going.

So, we have to have a way to define our specific route, forcing the GPS to bend to our will. So, what I have found to get around "our" failings", is to Mapquest my route, putting in waypoints to force my route...then transferring that to the GPS...and it actually works pretty well....I'm probably over analyzing it anyway, as I never take my planned route. Once I'm actually there, I find roads that look more interesting in person then the road I selected from the map.

 

[markjenn]

::026:: Mapsource to me is like a unicorn - I've heard all about it, but never have been able to find where to buy it, how to install it, etc. I've tried several times and never managed to get it.

Mapsource is something that is installed when you buy any Garmin map set . Once it is on your computer, then you can run their free upgrade programs to keep it up to date.

But.... their "prior version check" is absurdly simple to defeat, at least it was a year ago when I last tried this trick. To get the current version up/running:

1. Download/unpack the latest Mapsource update from Garmin. Currently, this is 6.16.3.

http://www8.garmin.com/support/download_details.jsp?id=209

2. Create a folder named Garmin on local C: drive. Inside the C:\Garmin folder, create a file named MapSource.exe. It can be blank, null, etc. - doesn't matter as long as a file of this name is there.

3. Install MapSouce by running the downloaded MapSource installation executable.

Another technique it to install Basecamp first (which if free also, but doesn't have the prior version check), and then install Mapsource. I haven't tried this, but others say it works. BTW, Basecamp also runs on the Mac.

BTW, it appears to me that Mapsource is gradually being phased out in favor of Basecamp. So investing time/effort in learning Basecamp might be a better investment. Both programs are pretty obtuse though and I've never been able to figure out how to do some things in Basecamp that are quite easy in Mapsource. OTOH, the learning curve of Mapsource to do route planning and route generation is pretty steep. But using the native Garmin programs does give you much better control of routes than you're likely to get using other route-planning software and importing/converting.

- Mark

 

[keeponriding]

Tried the MapSource thing...didn't work...tried it in C and in C;/Programs...neither worked..

I downloaded and played a bit with basecamp...it is an ugly interface....very difficult to navigate, especially in comparison with the obvious ease-of-use advantages of Mapquest and Google Maps;

 

[markjenn]

Tried the MapSource thing...didn't work...tried it in C and in C;/Programs...neither worked..

I just tried it on a "virgin" computer and like you say, it wouldn't install MapSource. But after installing Basecamp, MapSource installed fine.

One interesting thing I noted is that Basecamp downloads and installs some kind of "Global" map database, but it is relatively coarse resolution, showing only major streets and highways. MapSource doesn't appear to install any maps by default whatsoever which makes sense since this application is supposed to be installed along with a Garmin map database. But it makes MapSource by itself a worthless product.

Neither Garmin application makes a whole lot of sense as a standalone route planning appl separate from the Garmin map products. There are better options. But if you own a Garmin map product, MapSource and BaseCamp are THE tools to manage your maps and built mapsets that are downloadable to most Garmin GPSs. I've been using City Nav and MapSource for nearly a decade and if you want fine control of excellent maps/routes on your GPS (especially for adventure touring - City Nav has the best coverage of goat trails I've seen), then this is a nice way to go. Once you now the tricks, you can built extremely convoluted routes on the PC and have good assurance that you can follow them on the GPS.

I've used MapQuest, Google Maps, and other online-oriented maps and they all have major problems if you start probing the corners of the envelope when you're building routes. And the process of converting routes from these products to routes that work on the GPS can be tricky - its often much easier just to use simple tracks, but you won't get turn-by-turn prompts.

The best online-oriented map product I've ever used is MotionX GPS Drive on the iPad. But it requires net connectivity on the road which basically means at $30/month 3G account. And if you're in an area of poor coverage, it stops working.

- Mark

 

[keeponriding]

Thanks, Mark...I was able to load MapSource after having previously loaded Basecamp.

I only played with Mapsource for 10 minutes, but don't get it..I find both this product and BaseCamp to be archaic. Especially in comparison with the advanced UI of Mapquest and Google Maps. As interfaces set new standards of ease-of-use and usability, the differences to older implementations become glaringly obvious...I'm assuming both base camp and Mapsource are older...though Basecamp does appear newer, the lack of city labels for smaller towns makes navigating the map difficult, at least for me.

I'll play with it some more...and will also see how well my Mapquest routes work this weekend after my rather long ride...navigating by the GPS. If I can figure out Mapsource by then, I may try to create routes in both programs for comparison.

Anthony

 

[Kevhunts]

::026:: Mapsource to me is like a unicorn - I've heard all about it, but never have been able to find where to buy it, how to install it, etc. I've tried several times and never managed to get it.

If you have aquired your Garmin GPS unit in traditional fashion, it should have come with a map CD called "City Navigator NT". You need this software in order for Mapsouce to work. The City Navigator maps are usually updated 4 times a years but you must purchase these updates.
http://www8.garmin.com/support/mappingsw.jsp

 

[markjenn]

I only played with Mapsource for 10 minutes, but don't get it...

You don't have any Garmin maps loaded, right? Trying to evaluate these applications without maps loaded is a little like trying to evaluate a motorcycle without gas in the tank.

And FWIIW, I detest the Google Maps interface. You have no idea how many hour's I've wasted trying to build a decent route with this product and having it choke or go beserk at the wrong time and get into an unrecoverable state. It's great if you just plug in Pt A and Pt B and ask for a route in-between, but god help you if you start doing anything very sophisticated. You can do things in MapSource in 30 secs that would take hours in Google Maps if you could do them at all.

A lot of this is simply what you're used to. There are fundamental differences in an online-based appl vs. a local-storage appl. The best mapping UI, IMHO, is Streets and Trips.

- Mark

 

[Venture]

The best mapping UI, IMHO, is Streets and Trips.

- Mark

I obviously haven't used Mapsource yet, but I've been a Streets and Trips user for years. In version 2010 (I think) they introduced the ability to use the Garmin GPS plug-in to send waypoints directly to the GPS. I would plan the entire route on S&T, making sure I had enough waypoints defined to keep the general route I wanted, and then import and assemble on the GPS into a custom route. Clunky, but you can't beat S&T's for planning a trip. The timings and ability to define stop times at each waypoint are invaluable.

 

[colorider]

I've never been real fond of Mapsource and the only time I use it is to download the updated maps to my Zumo. For most trip planning I use Street Atlas and just rough out my approximate waypoints. I then enter these in my Zumo and create my actual route.

Works for me!!!

 

[markjenn]

I've never been real fond of Mapsource and the only time I use it is to download the updated maps to my Zumo. For most trip planning I use Street Atlas and just rough out my approximate waypoints. I then enter these in my Zumo and create my actual route.

Basically what I do too - use a combo of different applications for route planning on the PC. Then fire up MapSource and in a few minutes have identical routes in MapSource. Then copy the routes to the GPS. (Creating routes on the GPS itself is pretty clunky on my little 60CSx although I've done it a few times when I'm on the road and am not carrying my PC or don't have time to fire it up.)

Lots and lots of different ways to skin the cat. Different efforts, different results. THE most important thing to me is "route fidelity" - having a route that I know exactly where it goes and knowing that the GPS is going to guide me exactly on that route.

- Mark