Am I crazy for considering a R1200GS?

[fredz43]

I learned something on that adv thread. Seems that the most common term for someone who buys a S10 instead of a GS is they are "price shoppers". Otherwise wouldn't everybody be riding a GS? ;D

I do agree with one point that Paul makes and that is buy what puts a smile on your face. My second S10, a 14ES is by far the best bike I have ridden in my 49 years of riding and at just over 17k miles, it puts a bigger smile on my face every time I ride it. My one experience in owning a BMW, a R1100S, was that the boxer engine was the most uninspiring motor of any bike I have ever owned, it had the engine character of an industrial air compressor. At this point in my life, I can buy what pleases me and if I liked the GS better than my ES, I would buy it, but I don't, so I won't. But that is just me and I guess that is also why I prefer riding my 40 year old Bultaco dirt bikes than the new Honda CRF250X I owned for only 2 years.

 

[trainman]

I learned something on that adv thread. Seems that the most common term for someone who buys a S10 instead of a GS is they are "price shoppers". Otherwise wouldn't everybody be riding a GS? ;D

I do agree with one point that Paul makes and that is buy what puts a smile on your face. My second S10, a 14ES is by far the best bike I have ridden in my 49 years of riding and at just over 17k miles, it puts a bigger smile on my face every time I ride it. My one experience in owning a BMW, a R1100S, was that the boxer engine was the most uninspiring motor of any bike I have ever owned, it had the engine character of an industrial air compressor. At this point in my life, I can buy what pleases me and if I liked the GS better than my ES, I would buy it, but I don't, so I won't. But that is just me and I guess that is also why I prefer riding my 40 year old Bultaco dirt bikes than the new Honda CRF250X I owned for only 2 years.

bear in mind the price difference between the GS and the S10 has varied over the years, at least here.
I believe in the UK when the S10 first came out it was seen as being far to expensive against BMW's and KTM's with more gadgets and extras in the price. It did not sell well.

my dealer thinks the S10 has picked up in sales here as its now at a good price and the word is out on how much better the gen 2 is

rather than price shopper I think its now 'is the BMW worth that much more' - as has been said BMW have a loyal following but for others I think the S10 has now joined the list of viable options worthy of a look.

 

[Defekticon]

You're not crazy for considering an R1200GS, you're insane for asking that question to the wrong audience

 

[Dogdaze]

Do what makes you smile, if it's a BMW then do it, you can always sell it if you cannot get on with it. I personally like the GS's, had a few, but as I only ride for pleasure the quirky failures of the newer models worry me, not saying that the 'hard start' does not or one or two of the ST's quirk might rear it's ugly head and leave me stranded miles from home. Hey, it's a bike afterall, how much of a bad choice can you make?

 

[EricV]

Ignore anything you read in the press about any bike. Objective they are not. Long term owners, they are also not. BMW makes a feature rich bike that's fun to ride. Go ride both and see what you like about each and consider what level of dealer service you will be doing as part of the cost of owning the bike. Consider the dealers in question and what kind of local reputation they each have with their customers.

Dealer service is never cheap. BMW dealer service is more expensive than most. We have an '11 F650GS twin in the garage. The warranty repairs have exceeded the new cost of the bike in 95k miles. Actually, at around 83k, when that was exceeded. It's a fun bike to ride that fits my wife better than anything else we have found. I'd push it off a bridge or give a homeless person the keys in an instant, given the chance to do so w/o requiring a divorce.

A close personal friend has owned and wrenched on BMWs for 20+ years and has a high mileage LT that he's done all the repair work on. He got good enough that he started a business repairing and servicing BMWs. (there's a telling statement there). I tried valiantly to dissuade him from buying a new LC GS, but he was bitten by New Bike Fever and there was no denying him another BMW. He still has the LT too. The first long ride that he and his wife took from Oregon to Utah it suffered a classic FD failure. Had to U-Haul it back home at no small expense and get it repaired at the dealer, under warranty, but not without a significant time frame being involved.

Anyone that tells you the re-re-re-re-designed BMW final drive have solved the problem is lying to themselves and to you. They occur much less frequently than they did back in '08 or so, but they still occur w/new bikes and low mileage bikes, not just high mileage abused/ridden hard/loaded up bikes.

It's your money and your fun. If you can afford it and have another bike to ride while the BMW is in the shop waiting on parts/repairs, do what makes you happy. If it's your only bike, it would be foolish to buy a BMW. Just my opinion from my experience.

 

[greg the pole]

You're not crazy for considering an R1200GS, you're insane for asking that question to the wrong audience

well put

my very short impressions of the gs wc

https://thetenerist.wordpress.com/2013/07/24/water-cooled-gs-vs-tenere/

 

[Donk]

My friend owns a '14 GS. I have ridden it several times, about 1000 miles total. He has a bunch of miles on it and has had no issues whatsoever. Another friend has a '15 GSA and has put 24,000 miles on this year with no issues. I love my S10 but imo the GS is a slightly sharper sword. Has a bit more power, better electronics and a sweet quick shifter that I wish the S10 had. No your not nuts buy what your heart tells you to. They are both nice bikes, Don't think you will go wrong either way.

 

[Big Blu]

I learned something on that adv thread. Seems that the most common term for someone who buys a S10 instead of a GS is they are "price shoppers". Otherwise wouldn't everybody be riding a GS? ;D

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We're never too old to learn something new, GOOD ON YAH!! ;D

Paul

 

[carrot]

Ya got anything constructive to bring to the table that can be helpful to the op? :-*

Paul

Nope. ::021:: with a Yamaha

 

[HeliMark]

Take a demo out and ride it. If it tickles your fancy and makes you smile, buy it. If you can get past the possible maintenance issues (every brand has some), it is a pretty good bike. I have never owned the GS, but I did have an RT (camhead) for several years. I put 41K miles on it in 16 months, and started having oil leak issues (5K miles out of warranty) and sold it. That bike really put a smile on my face, and I see another one in the future if I can get around the maintenance issue's.

Mark

 

[Madhatter]

big blue, 55 years riding experience is awesome , and you've owned 50 plus motorcycles , wow. about 1 bike a year,so how can you know anything about a bike if you've not kept one for very long... and how can you rack up 250k plus miles on anything if your constantly changing bikes . and maybe you had 1 core bike you would ride a lot to put some miles on one it would take the average car driver 10 years to put that mileage on a car. and I believe you said bikes have been your primary mode of transportation so I can see some getting their bike to those numbers... maybe... ok, we will take your word for it, and I take my hat off to you for your amazing riding career, I know I will never come close to that... but I've got ask you this , why are you on this forum? this forum is for those who own and like this bike... you don't like this bike, that is your right... but this is the Yamaha super tenere forum , we like this bike , some have even started on there second tenere's ownership experience... ive had mine for 3 years 25 dollar headlight harness was replaced on warranty, that's it.. I ride on average 5 days a week , that is my life, its all I can do... I also like bmw gs motorcycles, ive been to the dealer enough to look at them. they have tech, power, etc. and they look good... but they are not a better motorcycle that a super tenere, take the steering damper off and it will probably try and kill you first chance it gets... it killed a motor journalist a few years back, so now the dampers are standard. a friend ( on his super t ) went through a pot hole he didn't see at 80 mph bike never missed a beat , kept tracking straight. stability is a good thing.. reliability a good thing.. 27000 mile valve adjustments are a good thing(plus or minus a few miles).. we are all glad you have found your perfect bike, when your happy we are all happy... for a lot of us we have found the bike that makes us happy, so leave it alone.. sorry you had a bad experience with dealers and Yamaha and this bike, I and others have not... and we are not on a bmw forum trying to convert bmw guys to yamahas. so to those who are considering the tenere you will like it, it is a great motorcycle....and to those who are considering a bmw gs , it to is a great motorcycle(bmw guys love their bikes) but its not better than a tenere... big blue you have a passion, and we are all motorcyclist, who love our bikes... that's why we hate cars, they are the enemy...stay focused.

 

[Big Blu]

big blue, 55 years riding experience is awesome , and you've owned 50 plus motorcycles , wow. about 1 bike a year,so how can you know anything about a bike if you've not kept one for very long... and how can you rack up 250k plus miles on anything if your constantly changing bikes . and maybe you had 1 core bike you would ride a lot to put some miles on one it would take the average car driver 10 years to put that mileage on a car. and I believe you said bikes have been your primary mode of transportation so I can see some getting their bike to those numbers... maybe... ok, we will take your word for it, and I take my hat off to you for your amazing riding career, I know I will never come close to that... but I've got ask you this , why are you on this forum? this forum is for those who own and like this bike... you don't like this bike, that is your right... but this is the Yamaha super tenere forum , we like this bike , some have even started on there second tenere's ownership experience... ive had mine for 3 years 25 dollar headlight harness was replaced on warranty, that's it.. I ride on average 5 days a week , that is my life, its all I can do... I also like bmw gs motorcycles, ive been to the dealer enough to look at them. they have tech, power, etc. and they look good... but they are not a better motorcycle that a super tenere, take the steering damper off and it will probably try and kill you first chance it gets... it killed a motor journalist a few years back, so now the dampers are standard. a friend ( on his super t ) went through a pot hole he didn't see at 80 mph bike never missed a beat , kept tracking straight. stability is a good thing.. reliability a good thing.. 27000 mile valve adjustments are a good thing(plus or minus a few miles).. we are all glad you have found your perfect bike, when your happy we are all happy... for a lot of us we have found the bike that makes us happy, so leave it alone.. sorry you had a bad experience with dealers and Yamaha and this bike, I and others have not... and we are not on a bmw forum trying to convert bmw guys to yamahas. so to those who are considering the tenere you will like it, it is a great motorcycle....and to those who are considering a bmw gs , it to is a great motorcycle(bmw guys love their bikes) but its not better than a tenere... big blue you have a passion, and we are all motorcyclist, who love our bikes... that's why we hate cars, they are the enemy...stay focused.

This thread isn't about me, I'm not sure how your comments help the op..

Me, I ride what I want when I want, it's my passion.
Obviously you see thing differently, that's what makes the world go around. ::008::

Paul

 

[shrekonwheels]

As is the following survey, also done by CR, which rates BMW higher than Yamaha in overall owner satisfaction:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2015/04/which-motorcycle-brand-has-the-highest-owner-satisfaction/index.htm

Reliability is important and the Yamaha is, on average, more reliable. But there is more to owning a vehicle than reliability, otherwise, we'd all be driving Toyota Camrys.

- Mark

What is more valuable than reliability in something which your life depends upon?

THe "Breaking down is part of the experience" is nothing more than sales BS sold to people who apparently are unable to see past such nonsense.

So lets say that BMW is less reliable than a S10. It costs 10k more, has higher maintenance and parts are likely more expensive as well. Unless you are making crazy money or are rich then what on earth would be the purpose of owning one? For anyone with any money sense at all clearly it should be on the S10 all day long.
However I realize that most Americans have the Money sense of a drunk Chimpanzee so you can scratch that.

Now with all that said I personally have no experience with the BMW, why I chose what I did is in my Sig line. I do know this however, I value my money which was part of my reasoning for owning the S10. I have better things to do than to give my hard earned money to someone else for Image or any other nonsense people toss at me.

 

[shrekonwheels]

To me., and I may be wrong for some, but what I've gathered over the years is there are at least three different type riders. Type one is out for cool, so only Harley will fill the bill, type two is out for "I'm a lawyer, doctor, whatever" and BMW only fills the bill, as I have money and don't mind paying others for services. Type three are looking for a less dollar investment, and a less dollar to run, but not as cool, and not what what a person like Bill Gates would ride, and that is the Japanese offerings. I've seen it first hand, have an uncle who bought both his kids and himself $100,000 Porches the same day, if I can even spell the name, as not worth squat to me, and a cousin who hasn't ridden since 1980, but lives in a $1.3m home. You think he wants a jap junk? Nope BMW.

I have no Idea the worth of your relatives, however the richest person I personally know makes a half billion a year, he drives a Jacked up Dodge truck, his wife some Japanese SUV hybrid, not for any kind of status, cause he is cheap as hell "P Super nice guy, just wears blue jeans and a button up shirt.

The key thing to remember is those who judge you, have no real impact upon your life. So who cares what someone else thinks? Personally I think the GS is a nice looking machine, however I think the Tenere is equally as good looking.
Couple of articles For your consideration
http://rollingout.com/2013/05/07/rich-people-who-drive-cheap-cars/

http://blogs.wsj.com/drivers-seat/2012/08/08/what-cars-do-wealthy-drivers-really-buy/

 

[trainman]

of course the irony in all this is, as people we seek empirical evidence to justify our choices and then get swayed by a free farkle or promise of a years free servicing or whatever!

I recall a similar long running thread on another forum, I looked it up and reminded myself of one of my comments - over recent years I had talked to various GS and Triumph owners at club rides and meet's, I would think it was an even 50/50 on who in each group had or had not seen issues with their bikes, but which group dwelled in my mind - the lot that had of course, so their comments moulded my choices - there's a physiological term for it that escapes me but basically we seek justification for a pre made choice to the denial of other equally valid cues in the opposite direction (some pilots do it just before they hit the dirt)

the 2nd irony is that the S10 appears to be a reliable bike but anyone of us might have one that ends up being a 'lemon' - is that karma or sod's law, not sure?

 

[Rasher]

This started off so well with people offering their honest opinions.

Let the Op decide who to believe rather than challenge peoples opinions, personally I find it hard to believe anyone has done huge mileage on any BMW made after the 1990's without issues.

I know Police riders who have done lots of miles on Boxers and normally can recount many a story of an FD failure (amongst others)

Early 1200Gs' owners were lucky to get the bike from the dealer to home without a Final Drive or Fuel Pump Controller failure, and if they did the chances are the EWS ring would fail and stop them going anywhere on day two. The K1200's / K1300's fours were also plagued with problems, as were the K1600's with a whole host of issues on early bikes, then we had the suspension debacle on the latest RS, and there were a few reported engine failures on early LC's in the UK (and I know someone who has blown up a 2014 model - total engine failure with bits flying out of the engine cases)

None of that guarantees a purchase of a new LC GS will be a disaster, I am sure far more are reliable than unreliable, you still need to be unlucky to have a lot of problems - but (IMO) you would need to be 100 times more unlucky to have a whole heap of problems on a Yamaha / Honda / Suzuki / Kawasaki - I have only ever personally known riders of BMW's that have needed a new engine under warranty, or had a multitude of re-calls....

...hopefully by now the beta testers have solved all the most common LC issues and I would expect a 2016 model to be OK, the first year of any new BMW I would steer well clear of, and by the time the problems on the first bikes are coming to light a load more are rolling down the production lines, after a couple of years fixes should have been found for most issues and by the third model year they should be incorporated into the bike from day one.

I would think about now is the best time to look at a new GS - soon they will be updating it and looking for new beta testers.

 

[Don in Lodi]

Hey, KCW lives on an island, how many miles can (one) realistically put on a bike? (The) insurance is helping out, sounds like a great plan, or is it Yamaha doing the helping? Will they help out as well going to a different brand?

Me, I heard rumors of a big Yamaha Adventure bike being made in 2010. Later on the same rumor mill said they're coming to the States. Put money down. Watched in horror with the rest of the world as a monster tsunami wrecked a huge chunk of Japan. Bike was put together one whole month later than planned, an incredible people. I've loved every minute of the last four years on this beast. I hang onto bikes a lot longer than some, 15 years and 110,000 miles for my last one. I haven't been off a bike for 36 years. Even with it's quirks, this is the best machine I've been on. Four years in and I've already passed the halfway point of my Royal Star. On track for 200,000 in 15 years? Jeez Louise...

KCW, you're on an Island, how far can you get any Brand from a dealership on an island? Go for what tickles your fancy. ::001::

 

[Dogdaze]

Hey, KCW lives on an island, how many miles can he realistically put on a bike? His insurance is helping out, sounds like a great plan, or is it Yamaha doing the helping? Will they help out as well going to a different brand?

KCW, you're on an Island, how far can you get any Brand from a dealership on an island? Go for what tickles your fancy. ::001::

Erm Don? I do believe KCW is a.............. she not a he! Gasp!!

 

[Don in Lodi]

Erm Don? I do believe KCW is a.............. she not a he! Gasp!!

I guess we need to get Venture to add a gender to our sigs... ::010::

 

[Donk]

big blue, 55 years riding experience is awesome , and you've owned 50 plus motorcycles , wow. about 1 bike a year,so how can you know anything about a bike if you've not kept one for very long... and how can you rack up 250k plus miles on anything if your constantly changing bikes . and maybe you had 1 core bike you would ride a lot to put some miles on one it would take the average car driver 10 years to put that mileage on a car. and I believe you said bikes have been your primary mode of transportation so I can see some getting their bike to those numbers... maybe... ok, we will take your word for it, and I take my hat off to you for your amazing riding career, I know I will never come close to that... but I've got ask you this , why are you on this forum? this forum is for those who own and like this bike... you don't like this bike, that is your right... but this is the Yamaha super tenere forum , we like this bike , some have even started on there second tenere's ownership experience... ive had mine for 3 years 25 dollar headlight harness was replaced on warranty, that's it.. I ride on average 5 days a week , that is my life, its all I can do... I also like bmw gs motorcycles, ive been to the dealer enough to look at them. they have tech, power, etc. and they look good... but they are not a better motorcycle that a super tenere, take the steering damper off and it will probably try and kill you first chance it gets... it killed a motor journalist a few years back, so now the dampers are standard. a friend ( on his super t ) went through a pot hole he didn't see at 80 mph bike never missed a beat , kept tracking straight. stability is a good thing.. reliability a good thing.. 27000 mile valve adjustments are a good thing(plus or minus a few miles).. we are all glad you have found your perfect bike, when your happy we are all happy... for a lot of us we have found the bike that makes us happy, so leave it alone.. sorry you had a bad experience with dealers and Yamaha and this bike, I and others have not... and we are not on a bmw forum trying to convert bmw guys to yamahas. so to those who are considering the tenere you will like it, it is a great motorcycle....and to those who are considering a bmw gs , it to is a great motorcycle(bmw guys love their bikes) but its not better than a tenere... big blue you have a passion, and we are all motorcyclist, who love our bikes... that's why we hate cars, they are the enemy...stay focused.

Big Blue is here because we like him here. Don't remember reading any signs about who was allowed on the forum. My new R1 has a steering damper. Does that mean it's not a good bike?