R1200GS vs Super Tenere - Operating cost comparison

[Big Blu]

I had a BMW once, and it cost me more in dealer work in the 1500 miles I owned it than the Super Tenere has in 23,000. Zero on the super, the BMW a botched first service visit they installed 3 problems when I had zero before I took it in. Don't they still do stuff like "service engine" reminders that you can't shut off yourself even if you do your own service? When I had mine they charged like $100.00 for 1 minute work to shut off a warning lamp. I suppose there is always electrical tape or wire clippers, but seems really rediculous to have to hack to not get ripped off.

Sound like your problem was dealer service related, not product related. One of my local dealer(BMW-Honda-Triumph) provide similar service to what you experienced to Honda and Triumph owners as well as BMW owners. I've learned to avoid going there but don't rag on Honda or Triumph products because of a piss poor dealer.

My "go to" dealer will reset the service indicator for free and they do it for any BMW rider that makes a request.

Paul

 

[shrekonwheels]

+ 1

Your comments reflect my personal experience with many BMW's.

Interesting how folks now want to bring purchase cost into the discussion. Maybe we also compare the capabilities of each like lectronics and integrated functions, and maube, depreciation/resale value, ect....
Naaaa, just kidding, none of that is important to most here.

::021::
Paul

Because money and budgeting is a real concern in our lives, if it was not I would never work again and would simply be out riding daily and hitting socialist strip clubs at night ::018::

The BMW is essentially twice the price of the Yami, and will have greater depreciation over time. If we take the two side by side, own them for a lifetime excluding tires gas and oil changes, doing valve adjust on the BMW yourself and the dealership for the Tenere the Yami will still be THOUSANDS cheaper.

So in short there is no comparison in this regard at all.

 

[shrekonwheels]

I would also like to add that the Yamaha has a longer warranty over the BMW as the yes can be purchased and the Tenere is still half the price.

I also would not get balled up over the dealer thing, there are two Yami dealers near me who are horrible, however there is a general motorcycle service center which is outstanding, I am sure he can follow the instructions for adjusting the valves on the Tenere just as easily as a Yami mechanic will have to as it's unlikely your typical mechanic will have worked on a Tenere.
So that is an option anywhere I am sure.

 

[MNs10]

I would also like to add that the Yamaha has a longer warranty over the BMW as the yes can be purchased and the Tenere is still half the price.

...

A longer warranty can be purchased for the BMW...7 years total.

There is no question that the initial purchase price is significantly higher for the BMW. Easy to use electronics that the operators can choose for themselves, the fabulous ESA with ride modes, stainless brake lines, more power, easier and less expensive maintenance, no need to flash, no need to upgrade suspension, a kick ass GPS that integrates with the bike...and more. Yes, not everyone needs to upgrade these things on the Tenere and not everyone can appreciate the improvements these things offer for the price...combine that factor with those who are concerned with initial price and the Tenere is a good option on paper but...

On the depreciation side...nothing I've seen in the history of motorcycles depreciated faster than the Tenere. In 2012 these bikes sold for 14,000+ (and required upgrades on top of that)...two years later you could buy a new one for under 10,000. Now you can buy a brand new first gen for under 9,000 otd (here). So, considering the history of the Tenere and value over time, what is a $15,000 initial purchase worth four years later? (especially considering the mileage of a bike that has actually been ridden). Percentages, of course, but THE talking about the depreciation of what a 2016 Tenere will be is wild speculation at best and cross your fingers hopefull...especially considering the history (all of it on this bike without exception) says otherwise.

I understand the need to compare to something to some extent but the lack of objectiveness is puzzling... If you love a bike, any bike, be happy with it. If you need to continuously justify why you have what you have, maybe some soul searching is needed.

 

[Rasher]

Some big regional differences here as well.

In the UK main BMW dealers are typically 25% - 50% more than franchised Jap dealers, this is what makes the BMW more expensive to service where I live.

In my experience I had more problems with BMW and my own personal opinion is they do go wrong more, and sometimes in spectacular fashion, but some people clock up vast mileages without issue, and in the UK BMW can be quite generous in fixing failings even post warranty - if you have paid the premium of BMW servicing from day one to failure, Yamaha will tell you to shove off the day the warranty expires in general.

New prices are also very different, in the UK the list price of the BMW is not all that bad for a base model, but fully kitted it comes up quite a bit more, additionally it is easy to get big discounts on pre-reg, ex demo and leftover S10's - I saved over 25% off list price buying a 6 month old bike with 149 miles on the clock - BMW's sell at full whack and ex demo's are not given away like with Yamaha.

Hard to be certain, as stated, in my opinions a BMW will most likely cost a bit more to keep on the road and lose a bit more on depreciation, but it is unlikely to be all that significant, plus anyone with the £15k+ for a new GS to spare is not likely to be all that concerned with depreciation - or else they would have bought a bargain basement S10

 

[shrekonwheels]

A longer warranty can be purchased for the BMW...7 years total.

There is no question that the initial purchase price is significantly higher for the BMW. Easy to use electronics that the operators can choose for themselves, the fabulous ESA with ride modes, stainless brake lines, more power, easier and less expensive maintenance, no need to flash, no need to upgrade suspension, a kick ass GPS that integrates with the bike...and more. Yes, not everyone needs to upgrade these things on the Tenere and not everyone can appreciate the improvements these things offer for the price...combine that factor with those who are concerned with initial price and the Tenere is a good option on paper but...

On the depreciation side...nothing I've seen in the history of motorcycles depreciated faster than the Tenere. In 2012 these bikes sold for 14,000+ (and required upgrades on top of that)...two years later you could buy a new one for under 10,000. Now you can buy a brand new first gen for under 9,000 otd (here). So, considering the history of the Tenere and value over time, what is a $15,000 initial purchase worth four years later? (especially considering the mileage of a bike that has actually been ridden). Percentages, of course, but THE talking about the depreciation of what a 2016 Tenere will be is wild speculation at best and cross your fingers hopefull...especially considering the history (all of it on this bike without exception) says otherwise.

I understand the need to compare to something to some extent but the lack of objectiveness is puzzling... If you love a bike, any bike, be happy with it. If you need to continuously justify why you have what you have, maybe some soul searching is needed.

Ohhh, I love these posts. Generally, regardless of bike you will lose 40 percent in depreciation over a few years I won a bit of cash of a Hog riding buddy running off on this one, he actually had higher depreciation vs more Japanese bikes. Since the purchase price on these bikes is significantly higher, odds are in 5 years you will still be in the 5 figure range, which sounds better until you do the math.

So if we take the GS vs Tenere 2012, which to be fair was the first year for the Tenere a relatively unknown bike, nevertheless this is what we get according to NADA.

GS MSRP in 2012 was 16995
resale value13525 =3475 loss or 21 percent


Tenere MSRP 14500
resale value today 10360
So a 4260 loss or 29 percent so roughly n 8 percent difference, wupee

Now we take the extra 2495 difference in new MSRP and add it to the above the loss


Now that sounds bad, cept we both know most people did not pay the 14500 for the Tenere.
For instance, I purchased mine 2 years ago for 10800 without so lets do the math here.

@ the real price of 10800 with a resale value today of 8250 we have a net loss of 2250 ::022:: not counting the 1200 in bonus goodies.

current Prices are significantly different with a MSRP of 16190 for the SuperT and a 18240 for the BMW GS for a difference of just over 2 k more.

So it appears that after all the fluff from both of us, it ends up being a wash for the most part.


::021::

 

[patrickg450]

I know this is the Tenere forum (I had one) so folks want bias in that direction and I’m sure this factual post (like a few others) will magically disappear but in the interest of those who want the truth and information from all angles I’ll post anyway…

Yea, it is like so unfair how the Great Supreme Mother-ship Yamaha North America deletes information, free information. Information that could save us down the road from ourselves. Kinda like how in China and Korea the Gov't removes stuff from the internet they dont want us to know.


I thought this was America?

 

[Big Blu]

Because money and budgeting is a real concern in our lives, if it was not I would never work again and would simply be out riding daily and hitting socialist strip clubs at night ::018::

The BMW is essentially twice the price of the Yami, and will have greater depreciation over time. If we take the two side by side, own them for a lifetime excluding tires gas and oil changes, doing valve adjust on the BMW yourself and the dealership for the Tenere the Yami will still be THOUSANDS cheaper.

So in short there is no comparison in this regard at all.

Operating cost, the subject of this thread, generally does not take into account unless used to calculate depreciation. And depreciation is generally not considered as an operating cost.

I regret you're unable to completely satisfy your fantasies of daily rides and strip club visits, that's so sad. ::025::

For the record I did not pay MSRP for my ST or for my GSA and I also make the 600 mile service part of both purchase deals. The Yamaha dealer didn't do the complete job the 1st time and when I want back to complain they wanted to charge me labor and shop costs to changed the final drive fluids. He said " we never do that on the first service" and this after I had specifically asked that it be done during the initial visit. They suck!

Paul

 

[Ramseybella]

Seriously Guys the snow has to have melted by now Go for a ride.
I would rather talk about Oil it's less of a pissing contest and Troll Patrol!

 

[r1d1]

Depreciation on the BMW may be avoided, simply by flooding the engine then holding in the starter button for two minutes when it refuses to start. BMW will then compensate you for the resultant self-immolation of the bike by speedily shipping you the latest model free, gratis, just like Yamaha does - surely >

 

[MNs10]

Ohhh, I love these posts. ....

So if we take the GS vs Tenere 2012, which to be fair was the first year for the Tenere a relatively unknown bike, nevertheless this is what we get according to NADA.

GS MSRP in 2012 was 16995
resale value13525 =3475 loss or 21 percent


Tenere MSRP 14500
resale value today 10360
So a 4260 loss or 29 percent so roughly n 8 percent difference, wupee

...

NADA makes it look better but lets get back to reality...it's possible but you would need to find a sucker that would pay 10,360 for a four year old gen 1 Tenere when you can currently purchase a brand new one for about 8,500. So, anyone willing to do a smidgen of research will put that 4 year old used bike price at about 7,000 (being generous with that number). - Continue with the speculation on the 2016 if you must but add about three grand to your figuring.

 

[Big Blu]

Seriously Guys the snow has to have melted by now Go for a ride.
I would rather talk about Oil it's less of a pissing contest and Troll Patrol!

Did about 240 miles yesterday, no snow, citrus in full bloom. Lunch here: http://www.yelp.com/biz_photos/the-boat-in-the-moat-ona

Sunday was pretty much a repeat of Saturday except for different lunch destination. Lunch was here on Saturday: http://www.gcmotorcycles.com/

Back on topic, hmmmm, wondering if can I subtract the cost of Saturdays lunch, provided by the dealer, from operating costs of my BWW?

All is well in the sandbox, life is good! ::003::

Paul

 

[RhodeTrip]

There is no good financial choice when it comes to motorcycles. Buy what you feel good about and like based on history of others, ride the hell out of it and hope that by taking care of it you can get over 100k miles. With any bike, the extended warranty that will carry you out to at least 5 years is a good consideration. Traction control, adjustable suspensions, ABS, selectable fuel mapping all have multiple components that can fail (on any Manufacturers bike), the cost to repair can add up. Again, motorcycles are not a good financial investments but they do wonders for our psychological state.
Jim

 

[Big Blu]

There is no good financial choice when it comes to motorcycles. Buy what you feel good about and like based on history of others, ride the hell out of it and hope that by taking care of it you can get over 100k miles. With any bike, the extended warranty that will carry you out to at least 5 years is a good consideration. Traction control, adjustable suspensions, ABS, selectable fuel mapping all have multiple components that can fail (on any Manufacturers bike), the cost to repair can add up. Again, motorcycles are not a good financial investments but they do wonders for our psychological state.
Jim

+1 You got that right Jim.
The best therapy in the world is the big smile the right motorcycle brings to us. ::012::

Paul

 

[patrickg450]

Here (MN) the warranty is 3 years for BMW, 1 for Yamaha.

The state makes BMW warranty their bike for 3 years?

 

[shrekonwheels]

There is no good financial choice when it comes to motorcycles. Buy what you feel good about and like based on history of others, ride the hell out of it and hope that by taking care of it you can get over 100k miles. With any bike, the extended warranty that will carry you out to at least 5 years is a good consideration. Traction control, adjustable suspensions, ABS, selectable fuel mapping all have multiple components that can fail (on any Manufacturers bike), the cost to repair can add up. Again, motorcycles are not a good financial investments but they do wonders for our psychological state.
Jim

Yup, and that kind of thinking is why most Americans are a Month away from bankruptcy.

 

[pe4496]

I traded a Honda ST 1300 for a SuperT ES a year ago. My wife has a 2010 R1200RT. BMW parts are very expensive. For example, Spark plugs are $18 each X 4. And they are dealer items. Auto parts stores cant even get them. Just bought 2 spark plugs for the ST. $4 each. Warranty is 3 times longer on the BMW. Good thing because things go wrong with BMW's. Never had to repair the Honda or so far the ST. And you have to leave room in the BMW panniers for spare oil (although the newer water cooled models may be better). We take long trips and I dont even think of having to repair the ST on the road. Not so with the BMW. I am not dumping on BMW. My wife loves the bike but my experience is that post warranty maintenance costs will be higher with the BMW. After riding my ST a number of times, my wife likes it better than the BMW from a comfort standpoint so she is trading the RT for a ST. Anyone interested in a 2010 RT?

 

[MNs10]

... My wife loves the bike but my experience is that post warranty maintenance costs will be higher with the BMW. ...

-Your crying about plugs on an older boxer motor and talking about 'your experience' with post warranty costs? ) If you had something worth mentioning you would have...

The new water cooled bikes use two plugs and they cost me less than four needed for the Tenere (and it only takes a few minutes to change them).

 

[Big Blu]

The state makes BMW warranty their bike for 3 years?

No, it's the policy of BMW NA and I believe it's the BMW Mottorad Corp. policy and applies world wide.

Paul

 

[Big Blu]

-Your crying about plugs on an older boxer motor and talking about 'your experience' with post warranty costs? ) If you had something worth mentioning you would have...

The new water cooled bikes use two plugs and they cost me less than four needed for the Tenere (and it only takes a few minutes to change them).

As with most comments here about BMW's they are in reference to older models, and I suspect some posting those comments may have never owned any BMW, let alone a modern BMW. It always seem to become a contest which about which bike is "best", when in fact that isn't the subject of the tread.
That's just the way it is on the inter-web, folks will believe parrot it and believe it if it fits their own narrative. No research, no facts, no personal experience, that's just the way it is on the inter-web.

Paul