OEM Panniers = Ankle Breakers in fall?

[Roge]

I use Wolfman, same capacity as OEM planners less bruises.

 

[mebgardner]

That does answer an ancillary question about soft luggage racks (and, thanks for the reply, good to know), but it's not really a response to why I've revived this thread.

 

[Don in Lodi]

When a bike with hard cases and robust crash bars is laid over they create a gap, a bridge, over the foot peg area. The pegs will still be folded because of where they have to be mounted, but the gap keeps the bike off the leg... if the leg stays in the gap above the peg. Between forward velocity and the brain's reflex of stabbing a foot into the ground in an attempt to stay upright, the leg very seldom remains in the bridged over space created by the panniers and crash bars. There's where the soft luggage comes in, that 90% likelihood that your leg will wind up under the boxes vs staying in the gap. My leg didn't stay in the gap. Didn't break a thing. Three months off work.

 

[mebgardner]

OK, understood.

However, there is another injury mechanism in view in this thread. It's mentioned a couple times, so I'm picking that up.

The mechanism is: Feet remain on pegs, hands remain on bars, bike is going down, they did everything correct (no foot down, or behind, no "dabbing", etc) and somehow... the rider receives a broken leg, even tho he stayed "in the gap".

How? Why? Can we prevent it?

 

[mebgardner]

Years ago I bought a 1150GSA from a guy that did the 'Long way Round' as a recon for Charlie and Ewan, and he had folding pannier racks on, and he said he only ever used soft luggage.

I searched for this "folding rack", and could not find any hits.

What is this?

 

[sjh]

I came off in a diesel spill on a french roundabout with luggage recently.

I was leaned over at a healthy angle when both wheels simultaneously came into contact with a diesel spill at ~30mph. I initially thought my left ankle had borne the weight of the bike on initial impact & I had moved with the bike. From looking at my boots (no damage) and watching my helmet cam footage I think the pain is due to hyperextension purely from my own weight / momentum. The bike moved away from me, i'm pretty sure my feet were free & i rotated the opposite way (clockwise) than I recalled. It seems i semi stood off the bike, then rotated over my foot before landing with force on my left knee.

I spent a few days in moderate discomfort & several more after resting but after a decent walk at the weekend to stretch out both myself and (much less importantly) the bike are fine.

Honestly i'm not sure if hard/soft panniers would have made any difference - I am however pretty sure that

[list type=decimal]
[*]In that specific instance no panniers could have been worse for both me & the bike * - if i was going slower my foot would have likely taken the weight, if i had no panniers the damage wouldn't be superficial
[*]Without decent knee armour (Rukka/D30) I'd be using crutches for a long time to come,
[*]Maybe most importantly, I should wear more robust boots. I was wearing TCX Infinity boots and am currently deciding between A* Toucan or Tech ? + sealskin socks.
[/list]

* in that specific instance - if they aren't needed they are off the bike, that GS pic is horrifying & they go nowhere near dirt unless essential!

 

[mebgardner]

My leg didn't stay in the gap. Didn't break a thing. Three months off work.

How you making out these days, Don? Doing OK? I've had a couple bad moments this past year, on dirt bikes. My reflexes are good, but they insist I put a foot down when having to attempt to recover the cycle from my bad riding. I stomp and plant, or "dab" too hard, and I see a white-out, then stars. No breaks either, but man it really gets my attention that I'm not riding well enough to keep my feet on the pegs.

I've decided on soft bags only, full time. I prefer'em anyway. I went round 'n round with the choices and offerings (so many!).

3.Maybe most importantly, I should wear more robust boots. I was wearing TCX Infinity boots and am currently deciding between A* Toucan or Tech ? + sealskin socks.

SJH, I've been riding for decades. I've had a bunch of friends coming to a decision about better boots only after a getoff involving ankles / shins. You made some really good protection choices beforehand, I hope you follow through on getting better boots. I wore A* Tech7 's in the store, could not walk in them. I don't know about Toucans. I don't like Goretex / WPV type barrier boots in general, they're too hot in Tucson. I bought A* Corozal, after my wife had a 0 MPH getoff last year (from her bike, she rides too) that wanted to crush her ankle (but did not, OMG Thank You!), and she started looking at better boots. Hindsight is great! (She *loves* her new A* Corozal boots, looks *such* a badass in them


Anyway, I'm wondering if the "Stay on Pegs, Stay on Bars = Stay in Gap" is really a moot point for me. I'm interested in *why* folks are apparently getting injured in that manner (sorry, SJH, your scenario does not "fit"), but I probably can not ride that well anyway. My instincts are to "dab" a foot down. Soft Bags for Me!

 

[Don in Lodi]

How you making out these days, Don? Doing OK? I've had a couple bad moments this past year, on dirt bikes. My reflexes are good, but they insist I put a foot down when having to attempt to recover the cycle from my bad riding. I stomp and plant, or "dab" too hard, and I see a white-out, then stars. No breaks either, but man it really gets my attention that I'm not riding well enough to keep my feet on the pegs.

Exploring some previously flooded back roads a month or so ago, in light, in shadow, in a corner, knew it could be there, should be there even, didn't even get a hint of the sand... my foot dabbed pavement before my conscious brain even detected the slide. No harm, no foul. Kinda spooky even.

 

[mebgardner]

The moment I remember the clearest from the last year: Last third of a long day, on good to poor trail and graded dirt roads. Probably over 100 miles at this point and not done yet. Not tired, but not fresh. I'm on a nicely graded dirt road, with good traction. RH blind turn, I slow to an appropriate blind corner speed (anticipating oncoming traffic / quads: always). Little Ole Lady, literally, is in the road right in front of me. As soon as I see her, the moment I lay eyes on her, the cycle does a weave and loses traction on front wheel. I *swear* I did not touch any controls yet, other than bars. I dab a foot to regain control, and I'm on the brakes and clutch now too. I don't go down, but I cant see anything either from the sheet of white that appears in front of me. That pain knifed right through my skull. I avoid her, and continue on (she has help on site already).

My lesson that day: Instinct has me dab a foot, and I need to figure out how to stay on pegs instead.

I repeat that mistake a few weeks later, and I still do not know how to train this out of me.

On this cycle, the ST, it might cost me bigger. I'm not looking forward to finding out

 

[bob dirt]

I got knocked/slammed off my bike when passing a ford excursion on a dirt road 6 weeks ago. He turned left right as I was almost around him and his front bumper hit my right Jesse bag and kicked my rear to the left hard slamming me to the ground. I totally blame my hard box for breaking my tibia AND fibula. Soft bags will be on my next bike.

A couple of years ago I was riding Titus canyon in Death Valley. My front wheel washed out on a left turn in the sand and my foot hit the ground before I could think about it. My pannier grabbed it and I thought it was going to break. I guess that should have been a sign. I'll rethink this whole thing about hard/soft, leaving them on or off when I get another bike. I was on a 2week adventure when I crashed. I had to ride with them.