Motorcyclists "are you kidding me?"

[Nissbird]

I spend some time watching You Tube motorcycle crashes in the hope they will instil caution into my riding and I think they do to some extent.
Lots of bikers in these videos say "are you kidding me?" when involved in a crash, most of which involve motorcycles hitting other vehicles.
I notice in particular the anger displayed by motorcyclists at other vehicle owners, yet to my eyes it is the motorcyclists fault.
In the UK road users are advised to drive with due care and attention and running into a car that has changed lanes or turned onto the road in front of you is not driving with due care and attention.
Many motorcyclists are travelling too fast to stop or manoeuvre past a vehicle unexpectantly appearing in front of them.

For the record as a youngster I have hit a car head on, T-boned one and bounced off the side of a bus and all these crashes were my fault.

I think the point I'm trying to make is - motorcyclists should ride safer and admit when they are in the wrong

 

[bob dirt]

I have been doing the same thing lately. Can't do much else with two casts and all. Most of the road rage and crashes are caused by idiot riders that are going way to fast and not looking ahead...and they cuss out everyone on a cell phone

 

[RCinNC]

LOL, I've seen those same "You've gotta be kidding me" videos, usually titled something like "Guy in red car almost kills me" (assuming it's possible to be killed by the turbulence generated by a car that passes by you at a distance of three or four feet). My favorite is when they post their "cager cuts me off" videos on a motorcycle forum expecting to be applauded for their supreme bike handing skills at avoiding the Grim Reaper, and instead get resoundingly criticized for being a total douchebag rider. That's some sweet, sweet Karma.

 

[Terminus]

Could not agree with you more. I watch a few channels that focus on this type of stuff like Moto Madness. It seems from my perspective the motorcyclist is at fault the vast majority of the time. They were either going way too fast, changing lanes all over the place, not coming to a complete stop, holeshotting traffic lights, lane splitting(whether legal or not) etc. etc. etc. Also even for the ones where a car merges into their lane, it is still partly/entirely the motorcyclist's fault most of the time. You should never put yourself in a car's blind spot and you should always assume they can't see you. Drive defensive not offensive!! Also back on lane splitting, I know it is legal in California to do this now, but that does not give the motorcyclist the right to demand a path and make cars give them room does it? It seems a lot of them get angry if the cager move over for them. Maybe I don't understand the law?? Just seems like it is a huge risk on the biker to do this. ::009::

 

[Dogdaze]

::026:: I'm of the view that if I act like a moron on a bike and sh1t happens then I must take responsibility, however, if I'm minding my business watching for the other morons and sh1t happens, I maintain my right to get pissed...............

 

[WJBertrand]

Certainly many cases are the motorcyclist's fault and maybe those u-tubers, are creating a disproportionate impression. Back in the early 80s Harry Hurt performed and published an extensive study of motorcycle accidents in Southern California. His results showed that a large majority of the accidents that involved a car vs. motorcycle collision, the car driver was found to be at fault. I think the number was something like 70% car driver's fault, but that may be off a few points. I can't see that any of the dynamics on the roads around here would change that except to possibly make it worse. Cell phones were nearly non-existent when the study was done and if anything, distracted driving seems to be worse these days. Cell phone use whilst underway is much less common among motorcyclists I would wager. I hardly count a day when I don't see a rear-end accident somewhere along my commute. Fortunately it's usually between two cars. I've commuted 40-50 miles to various jobs since the late 70s and these kinds of accidents used to be relatively rare.

 

[Terminus]

Certainly many cases are the motorcyclist's fault and maybe those u-tubers, are creating a disproportionate impression. Back in the early 80s Harry Hurt performed and published an extensive study of motorcycle accidents in Southern California. His results showed that a large majority of the accidents that involved a car vs. motorcycle collision, the car driver was found to be at fault. I think the number was something like 70% car driver's fault, but that may be off a few points. I can't see that any of the dynamics on the roads around here would change that except to possibly make it worse. Cell phones were nearly non-existent when the study was done and if anything, distracted driving seems to be worse these days. Cell phone use whilst underway is much less common among motorcyclists I would wager. I hardly count a day when I don't see a rear-end accident somewhere along my commute. Fortunately it's usually between two cars. I've commuted 40-50 miles to various jobs since the late 70s and these kinds of accidents used to be relatively rare.

That is a fine point. I often wonder if the youtubers are creating the situation just so they have content. Either way, they make great videos on recognizing dangers.

 

[Sierra1]

::026:: I'm of the view that if I act like a moron on a bike and sh1t happens then I must take responsibility, however, if I'm minding my business watching for the other morons and sh1t happens, I maintain my right to get pissed...............

::026:: "Don't start none, won't be none".

 

[bnschroder]

I have only been riding motorcycles for about 10 years, but bicycles for 40. Best advice my mother ever gave me was "ride like nobody sees you". I still adhere to that principle and so far it has served me well.
I must confess that I also watch motorcycle crash videos both for educational purpose (what not to do) and probably also because I have poor character and am too prone to "Schadenfreude".

 

[RCinNC]

Long time motorcyclist and bicyclist here, and I long ago modified that phrase to, "ride like everyone else on the road is actively trying to kill you".

 

[AVGeek]

@ Terminus getting back to your lane splitting question, I did it for about 5 years of solid commuting right in the belly of the beast (LA/OC). I saw plenty of squidly behavior, but at the same time, most cagers would keep to their lane position, and getting past was easy. Every now and then, you would get one that would crowd you out; in that case I would usually have to stop until traffic started moving again, and then would eventually get by anyway. Lane splitting made commuting so much better that the occasional negative encounter was much easier to deal with, and I always arrived at my destination in a much better mood than when I was stuck in a cage.

 

[HeliMark]

Also back on lane splitting, I know it is legal in California to do this now, but that does not give the motorcyclist the right to demand a path and make cars give them room does it? It seems a lot of them get angry if the cager move over for them. Maybe I don't understand the law?? Just seems like it is a huge risk on the biker to do this. ::009::

The law gives you the right to split when safe, but does not give you the right to demand it. But with anything, people abuse it. Look at all the Dale Earnhardt's on the freeway in cars.

It is amazing, considering it is California, that 95+% of drivers actually make sure there is room for you when splitting traffic. Heck, I use to split through downtown L.A. on a Harley Ultra Classic. ??? ::001::

I feel safer splitting, than when I am not able to in heavy traffic (other states).

Mark

 

[Defekticon]

Was riding this morning, came around a blind 25 mph curve on the right side of my lane to find a chevy pickup truck across the double yellow line 2/3rds of the way into my lane.

I said "Are You F*****G kidding me" loud enough for them to hear me through their open drivers window. Luckily they didn't hit me as they swerved back into their lane.

Still would've been their fault, but fault is not relevant when you're dead.

 

[RCinNC]

I see so many guys on bikes crossing the centerline on curves that I sometimes worry more about encountering a motorcycle in my lane than I do a car.

 

[Sierra1]

....but fault is not relevant when you're dead.

That's what I told my kids when they were learning to drive. And as bnschroder was told, so were my kids, ride like you're invisible. It works no matter what you're riding/driving. Oh, and look as far down the road as you can. The sooner you identify a potential problem, the more time you have to avoid it.

 

[yoyo]

I've done a bit of advanced training and it's surprising what it opens your eyes to, you get to see things far in advance of something happening but it seems many bikers appear to ride either with their eyes closed or looking 6 foot in front of the bike. It's a known fact that many car drivers don't see us, even when we have extra lights and hi viz on and we need to ride our bikes with that in mind, when idiots choose not to ride defensively they blame the cadger for trying to kill us when all that was needed was a bit of observation on our part. You are quite correct that many jump on the band wagon and defend the biker (I've got Facebook friends who continually do it), I often feel for the driver who makes a small error but get total abuse from a biker when in fact nothing happened other than there's a bit more footage for YouTube. There's a guy I won't name on the Strom forum who produces videos or poor driving but you can see he goes looking for trouble, he puts himself in positions where he confuses drivers then gives them a pile of abuse while pointing at the camera on his helmet the whole time. Some people shouldn't be allowed to have bikes.

 

[Nissbird]

::026::
Yes I've seen one or two of those videos you mention, he really is a knob, he does not do the biking fraternity any favours

 

[Terminus]

@ Terminus getting back to your lane splitting question, I did it for about 5 years of solid commuting right in the belly of the beast (LA/OC). I saw plenty of squidly behavior, but at the same time, most cagers would keep to their lane position, and getting past was easy. Every now and then, you would get one that would crowd you out; in that case I would usually have to stop until traffic started moving again, and then would eventually get by anyway. Lane splitting made commuting so much better that the occasional negative encounter was much easier to deal with, and I always arrived at my destination in a much better mood than when I was stuck in a cage.

That sounds like what I thought the law's intention was. Lane split when safe and there is space. But you can't demand the sea of cars to part for you like you are Moses or something.... ;D

 

[AVGeek]

That sounds like what I thought the law's intention was. Lane split when safe and there is space. But you can't demand the sea of cars to part for you like you are Moses or something.... ;D

Exactly...although mentioning Moses reminded me of a time I wound up splitting behind an LA County Sheriff motor officer...it was like the parting of the Red Sea!

 

[greg the pole]

Exactly...although mentioning Moses reminded me of a time I wound up splitting behind an LA County Sheriff motor officer...it was like the parting of the Red Sea!

The few times I made the trip to Cali (4 and hopefully counting) I lane split every single time. I felt a lot better splitting than sitting in traffic, you got away from the lights much faster, and IMO away from potential danger.
Why it's not legal everywhere else boggles the mind.
BTW..95% gave room every single time, except for the ones not paying attention, or the spiteful haters..

here's a rear facing POV through SF rush hour traffic
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dekire1rsDI&list=UUzSJeqjKkwDjhSJlT5T4hfQ&index=54