If my goal is to have a smooth S-10

[Toxic Mark]

If my goal is to have a smooth running 1st Gen S-10 while keeping the bike's exhaust system stock what am I looking at doing?

CO adjustment
Air screw adjustment and TB sync
2nd Gen ECU flash
Clutch basket
Newer cam tensioner
PCV
?

 

[Twisties]

Start motor, twist throttle, go...

 

[sail2xxs]

My 1st gen seems very smooth, and definitely got smoother after the 10k mile mark.

Best,

Chris

 

[Toxic Mark]

My 1st gen seems very smooth, and definitely got smoother after the 10k mile mark.

Best,

Chris

And you didn't tune your bike in any way?

 

[NoMorBills]

Ride it! As time goes on either it smooths out or you just get use to it.
It isn;t a bike for pussies. its a mans bike. You want smooth go get a Goldwing.

 

[terryth]

The ST is all ready incredibly smooth for a 1200 cc vertical twin, ever ride an xs650 yamaha or old triumph?

 

[longride]

If my goal is to have a smooth running 1st Gen S-10 while keeping the bike's exhaust system stock what am I looking at doing?

CO adjustment
Air screw adjustment and TB sync
2nd Gen ECU flashenere
Clutch basket
Newer cam tensioner
PCV
?

As said already, go buy a Goldwing. The Tenere will never be perfectly smooth, nor should it be.

 

[Toxic Mark]

Maybe I worded my question wrong. In order to get rid of the off idle stumble, the increased vibration around 3000 rpm and the rattle can cold start to make my S-10 a smoother running twin...

 

[tubebender]

The TB sync and CO adjustment should help the off idle stumble on a 1st gen California bike.

The 3000 rpm 'growl' may be solved by the clutch basket change. To date, only AlsoRan has done this and says it works.
I've met him and trust his observations.

Everything else, a re-flash is the answer. avc8130 does custom flashes for a reasonable price.

 

[Karson]

Maybe I worded my question wrong. In order to get rid of the off idle stumble, the increased vibration around 3000 rpm and the rattle can cold start to make my S-10 a smoother running twin...

Off idle stumble - Flash fixed mine
Vibes - i don't have RPM specific vibes. I'm usually ::26:: right through 3,000 and maybe just to naive to notice
Not sure what you mean by rattle can at startup, but likely sounds like you either have timing chain tensioner pressure just building up, worn chain guides, or a chain that's way to loose. Either that or it's the valves clicking that you hear...

I can't imagine that you haven't seen the firestorm of posts on the 2014 Cam (timing by the book) chain tensioner "update". But if not, just browse here a little bit more ::008::

 

[Toxic Mark]

I have. Information overload. My goal is to not have to keep taking the bike apart and am just making sure I've picked up on all of the current issues with the first gen. So I'm throwing out the list in my first post to see if I'm missing anything. It's starting to look like I've got a pretty comprehensive list with one extra, the PCV, that may be unnecessary on a stock bike.

So far This is what I understand...

-If I adjust the CO setting, do it before the air screw and the TB sync.
-If i do the air screw and TB sync It would be a good time to update the CCT as I need to take the tank off to do that.
-If I update the CCT hold off until I update the clutch basket as I need to take the clutch cover off to release the spring on the CCT.
-If I re-flash the ECU don't do it until I have decided to keep the exhaust system stock or upgrade it, because they can optimize the re-flash for what I have.
-If I keep the exhaust stock there is no need for a PCV
-If I decide to upgrade the exhaust be prepared to melt my credit card because I will need to tame the fueling issues having catless headers creates with a PCV and an AT and O2 optimizers and additional widgets that do other things to compensate for more other things...headache.

Yes, yes, ride more worry less. The idea here is get it done once and right so I can ride more and worry never.

 

[AlsoRan]

If my goal is to have a smooth running 1st Gen S-10 while keeping the bike's exhaust system stock what am I looking at doing?

If your goal is to have a smooth running bike with stock exhaust then these changes will cover it.

Air screw adjustment and TB sync
2nd Gen ECU flash
2014 Clutch basket

The only thing I did differently than most is I had a custom Gen-2 flash done which slightly hopped up the touring "T" mode. It's a perfect compromise of power with controllability, sort of in-between "S" and "T". Other than that each change has it's specific enhancements. Now it's smooth with plenty of power for all situations.

I will change the cam chain tensioner with the valve adjustment.

 

[Toxic Mark]

Thanks!

So, no reason to mess with the CO setting in stock configuration?

 

[corndog]

Borrow a Vstrom for a week. Then the ST will be the smoothest bike you have seen in a "week".

Maybe I am lucky or dense, but the Tenere I bought (orphan 2013) had a little off idle stumble. The throttle cable had a ton of free play also. I corrected the throttle immediately and rode the beast. I never, ever mess with fueling on new bikes until some miles have built up. Now with 8,000 the bike rides beautiful.

I repaired bikes professionally for almost 10 years before switching occupations (anal retentive, OCD engineer now) then tinkered with bikes for 2 decades more. The tenere is pretty close to perfect.

My Vstrom ran a very similar clutch which had some vibration "chudder" we called it. Many switched baskets. Others just rode....and rode....rode some more......then as miles built up forgot about it. My.....as some have put it, cheap and poorly designed basket was still going strong at 100,000 miles. Never notched, never got worse, never exploded....just vibrated under load at a certain rpm.

I expect this bike to go 100,000 miles also and would never touch the clutch until it started slipping. ::021::

See ya on the highway friends

 

[NoMorBills]

You are going to get so many different responses. Everybody has an opinion on how to debug their bike. Some will throw $$ at it others will twist this and that. The bike is set up very well stock all though you do have a California spec bike so it has the evap canisters. I don't believe it is tuned any differently though.

My opinion: The off idle stumble is the ECU throttle control kicking in.
* either use the CJM AKA fuse in the clutch switch which will give you full throttle control and remove the stumble totally
Or get a reflash that removes most of the delay and allows you to still select Sport or Touring mode.

*3000 rpm vibs, Mine seetled down after about 20,000 miles or I just got use to it.
I still have the stock clutch basket and will keep it till the whole clutch goes.

Reflash--???? Must do if you change air in and air out otherwise if you mess with the flow by changing to a higher flowing
exhaust or air cleaner. More air means more fuel. If you keep the stock head pipe with the cats intact then
an aftermarket exhaust will give you more bark but little bite.
If you are a speed freak then go for it all the way. Head pipe Muffler and tune.

What type of tune???
An ECU tune is a cook book tune that is for mainly a stock bike. IMO
A tune done by some one that actually gets in and sets up your ECU to your specs or uses a dyno is by far
the best way to go.
A Power Commander (PC) Is a way to control the fueling your self and is used by many that have had the
ECU gen 1 & 2 flash

Disclaimer; These opinions are my own and are solely owned by me. Do what you need to to satisfy your needs!

My bike has 34,000 miles, I have the CJM in and never take it out ON or OFF road. I have a good hand.
I put a yosh pipe on recently. I have never done the screw thing. That is strictly an idle thing and is useless once you crack the throttle. The plates are not adjustable individually.

 

[sail2xxs]

And you didn't tune your bike in any way?

No tune aside from TB sync.

Best,

Chris

 

[triman11427]

I've ridden other S10's and there are differences between bikes. My bike had all sorts of vibration issues and a friend of mine had none. He didn't know what a chudder was until he rode mine. So, those without these issues just won't get what your talking about. I put on a LV pipe, changed the air filter, did both flashes(2nd gen way better) and just switched out the clutch basket. Each mod made a difference in the bikes performance. I have 15K on this bike and the vibes did not disappear with mileage. The clutch basket corrected the chudder and also smoothed out the vibes throughout the rpm range. Anything left is part of the Parallel twin character. I'm very happy with how the bike rides. Some people feel any of the vibes, chudder, clunks etc. are part of the bike's character. That's fine, I get it. For me, I like the bike to perform according to my needs and I'm lucky enough to be able to chase that dream. I think I'm there. Good luck in your attempts to find Super Tenere perfection.(Sarcasm intended) ::015::

 

[toadady]

i think with the 270 deg. offset crank pin it's never going to be a smooth as a electric motor

 

[Mzee]

All these problem you folks mention are alien to me. What is wrong with my bike? I have 83,000km and have no complaint whatsoever. Never flashed the ECU, using stock pipe, etc ::013::

 

[coastie]

My stumble and vibe completely disappeared with the flash.