How Lucky We Are

[Rasher]

It seems BMW are now having to swap out engines on 2013 GS models...

http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?362855

Oddly they seem to get a great reputation by building awful bikes and then going to great lengths to fix them, whereas Yamaha seem to get very little credit for building a dependable one.

I have also heard of a couple of 2013 GS' being replaced entirely in the UK - and we do not have any Lemon Law so it has to be pretty serious before you get another bike under UK warranty.

Makes you wonder how many more faults will develop as the bikes get older and higher mileage, I certainly would not want to buy one just after the warranty has run out ???

 

[creggur]

I've spent a lot of years in the car business (17 now...damn, I'm getting older) in the parts and service side of things, and I've never seen a brand-new model that didn't have some issues. I've worked with American, German, and Asian brands, so I have a variety of experience there as well.

I think the Tenere is more the exception than the rule - and kudos to Yamaha for pulling it off - building a new model from the ground up that folks have tried to break and it won't. Most people can't appreciate the amount of engineering, testing, re-engineering, re-testing, re-on-and-on-and-on....that it takes to produce something that is as rock-solid out of the gate as the Tenere is.

Having said that, of all the manufacturers I've worked for, the Germans have their, how shall we say, "ways" about them. Their machines are a joy to drive, but that joy comes at a price (often long-term reliability) especially if maintenance schedules aren't very strictly adhered to. They perform...oh boy do they perform! But when they break don't expect the Germans to admit it had anything to do with their design/engineering. Not gonna happen. And if you're out of warranty, hang on to that credit card nice and tight, because you and it are about to go on a wild ride.

 

[spasm]

a friend of mines gs1200 caught fire while he was riding it 3 weeks ago. it was less than 2 years old, right off

 

[Rasher]

I've never seen a brand-new model that didn't have some issues......

I think the Tenere is more the exception than the rule

I don't, I have not heard of lots of major failures on the R1 / R6 / FJR / V-Max or any other Yamaha, I also moderate a ZZR1400 Forum and they are also bulletproof with no major failures (apart from on a 6 year old bike that was run low on oil) and I have never come across anyone needing a new engine under warranty on any Jap bike.

I think this is where the Japanese are still way ahead of the game, although I think some European stuff is getting better it is still not quite there yet, and BMW seem to get worse if anything.

A mate of mine bought a Tiger explorer, it is a year old with about 2,000 miles on the clock and has had a new cylinder head, at the same time they replaced the Final Drive due to "corrosion", but the bike was mint so I suspect they know of a flaw and were keen to change it while the bike was in for other work - and it has now gone back for a new ECU, not a software update, but a complete ECU.

In all fairness to Triumph they have done the work with no quibbles, which surprised me as they have a reputation for trying to wriggle out of warranty work, BMW are also very good at fixing things, but I would rather not have the worry that seems to come from any motorcycle not from Japan.

 

[stutrump]

Blimey. First time in my life that Ive felt pleased to have a thin wallet. To be honest....out of KTM Beemer Triumph Honda etc...the reason I bought the Tenere is because (used) it was the cheapest in UK. Test rode the Explorer and Crosstourer (for fun) and if Id had a bigger budget Id have bought the Triumph...reckon it was the most fun to ride. Looks like it was lucky I was on a budget! Hopefully my engine wont need replacing....ever I hope!

 

[GrahamD]

Blimey. First time in my life that Ive felt pleased to have a thin wallet.....Hopefully my engine wont need replacing....ever I hope!

The Triumphs are all down at the dealers getting the top half of the motor replaced, and you guessed it, accolades to Triumph for looking after their customers, well deserved, but no thought about it not happening in the first place. Judging by the comments I hear about 1st year models, I assume most people think this is normal, like Final Drive failures. (Haven't seen any on the GSW yet, they seemed to have moved the problem into the motor)

So far I have found nothing nasty on the Xtourers, which if you think about it wasn't a totally first year model when it came out.

I have a strange feeling that some peoples "marketing driven" logic goes like this.

If the "German engineered" quality product like BMW has this much trouble imagine what a [insert inferior product here] would be like.

OR

Damn, I am glad I bought a BMW with a great warranty, otherwise I'd be paying for this all this work.

OR this is what came out of BMW's marketing department when they won the Recall king in 2005 (That's right it's not an aberration this problem), with both most recalls and most models affected.

The SEEMINGLY high number of recalls shows our commitment to providing the customer with the most reliable product possible.

Yep. Seemingly high.

So, as with many things, If you say otherwise, you are just "Hating on BMW". Truth hurts after $26,000 dollars.

But on the other hand, if you are a returning rider cashed up empty nester, that last rode a bike in the 70's, then 30% failure rate (yes Consumer reports survey) probably just seems normal and that 3 year warranty is great and the shops are really nice and the staff are all confused about why this happened and the ego stroking is nice. They hardly ever see it. Very sorry about this. Well I suppose some of them would go as far as saying they are Sorry.

But as things are all about averages here, that doesn't mean that YAMAHA is immune obviously.

It will be interesting to see, as Honda and YAMAHA start more platform sharing whether they will invest some of the slimmed down development costs into extra resources to make sure everything is sorted as now one problem will affect multiple models. That would bust the low numbers a bit and may explain some of the increase in BMW recall figures, as they tend to try and fill every niche with one platform even if it's a bit silly.

 

[GrahamD]

It seems BMW are now having to swap out engines on 2013 GS models...

http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?362855

Tunes!! Flashes!!

Sounds familiar.