Front brakes not working

jbrown

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In the past, I've seen bikes ridden with one rotor removed. The pads on that side just met each other instead of squeezing on a rotor. If the pads have enough material on them, and there's enough extra movement left on the piston, that could get you by for a week. I'd do that if I was in the middle of nowhere and needed to get somewhere. Use your own judgement!
 

bigbob

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jbrown said:
In the past, I've seen bikes ridden with one rotor removed. The pads on that side just met each other instead of squeezing on a rotor. If the pads have enough material on them, and there's enough extra movement left on the piston, that could get you by for a week.
Or put a spacer between the pads, Duct tape maybe. Since it will not be spinning, just about anything that will not blow away to keep the piston for bottoming out.
 

EricV

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Heck, just pull the caliper off and get a shorter banjo bolt from the local auto store, hose shop or hydraulic tools dealer. Especially if it's the right rotor, that dumb cross over hose can be removed that way.

I had good luck with after market rotors by Braking. They are Italian and good quality. I ran some on the FJR for a bunch of miles, (~60k), with no issues. http://www.braking.com/ They sometimes show up on ebay too.
 

SilverBullet

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Derekj said:
Here is what I'd do. I would put the bike on the center stand and disable the ABS, then go for a little ride to see if the brakes work. If they do then obviously its the abs. I would also take the rotor off after my test and lay it on a flat bench and beat it with a rubber mallet to straighten it for more testing purposes, while you wait for a new one.
Disabling the ABS is one of the first things I did and had no effect (see my first post). I pulled the ABS fuse which incidentally also disables the speedo and odometer. I am going to try and pound the rotor into submission in the morning. If it is not 100% perfect after I will order a new OEM rotor.

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SilverBullet

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dcstrom said:
Ok so I was right! :D you DO have a very visible warp. Still surprised that it would cause you to lose ALL braking though - I've ridden bikes with warped discs and the worst thing is feeling a pulsing at the lever. It's hard to imagine the warp being so bad that when the disc pushes the pad back, the pressure at the lever doesn't recover almost instantaneously. And you said that when you lose the brakes, even when you pump it, it doesn't recover?How could that be anything to do with the rotor? I hope it is the rotor, means it's a easy fix, but I still have my doubts...
Pumping doesn't really recover the brakes as you cannot pump fast enough. If you were rolling very slow you could do it some. As soon as the wheel spins and the bad spot on rotor passes thru the caliper then the brakes are gone again. Think how quick one revolution of the front wheel must be at speed. Probably tenths of a second only.

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Don in Lodi

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The whole point of floating discs is so that they can absorb the disc runout and essentially be 'straight' all the time. That first photo shows a pretty bad wack to one of the pucks. If it's seized, the rotor can't come back to straight. I don't think a hammer is gonna fix this one.
 

offcamber

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Honestly...park the bike until you replace the rotor. Its not worth trying some half ass fix. These are brakes not some convenience item. No offense but you are putting yourself and others on the road at risk to continue to ride it in this condition.
 

SilverBullet

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offcamber said:
Honestly...park the bike until you replace the rotor. Its not worth trying some half ass fix. These are brakes not some convenience item. No offense but you are putting yourself and others on the road at risk to continue to ride it in this condition.
Bike has been sitting and as I stated it is not safe to ride it with rear brake only. By neccessity only I had to ride it home from MS as I was stranded and had no choice. I rode accordingly. If rotor can be straightened and brake recovers it is not a half ass'd fix it will be 100% safe and allow me to ride the bike until the new rotor arrives. I'll know this afternoon and post my results.

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SilverBullet

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Don in Lodi said:
The whole point of floating discs is so that they can absorb the disc runout and essentially be 'straight' all the time. That first photo shows a pretty bad wack to one of the pucks. If it's seized, the rotor can't come back to straight. I don't think a hammer is gonna fix this one.
^ this ^

I beat on the rotor for a good hour and made a huge improvement but couldn't get it perfect. Gave up as I think a problem also with that impacted puck and I didn't want to waste more time on it. If it was a non floating rotor I could have fixed it. Brakes now 50% better and very little pump up needed but still go back down so bike will sit until PartsFish.com delivers the new rotor next week. Good news is based on the partial straightening and corresponding improvement in brakes I know definitely the rotor is the cause.

Thanks everyone for the replies, ideas and help.

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scott123007

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Don in Lodi said:
The whole point of floating discs is so that they can absorb the disc runout and essentially be 'straight' all the time. That first photo shows a pretty bad wack to one of the pucks. If it's seized, the rotor can't come back to straight. I don't think a hammer is gonna fix this one.
Someone gave you some bad info if you think that is the whole point of floating disks. ???
 

Don in Lodi

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scott123007 said:
Someone gave you some bad info if you think that is the whole point of floating disks. ???
Please elaborate. I'm always looking to fill in blank spaces. I know they help with heat management, but in this scenario warp was the problem.
 

scott123007

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Don in Lodi said:
Please elaborate. I'm always looking to fill in blank spaces. I know they help with heat management, but in this scenario warp was the problem.


Full floating rotors, were designed to reduce the tendency towards thermal stress induced distortion due to uneven thermal expansion under load. Prior to the introduction (by Brembo) of this design, brake rotors in the motorcycle industry were simply round discs bolted solidly to the wheel. You may remember if you've been around long enough, the rotors on the early CB750 and Z-1's were nearly 7mm thick and weighed accordingly. This was in effort to keep them from warping. Now days, the only road bikes coming through with solid mount (front) brakes are the Cruisers and budget bikes.

True full-floaters move on the carriers, this allows them to self-center in the caliper for reduced brake drag and "float" unimpeded for unrestricted expansion and contraction during repeated thermal cycling. The only serious down side is a bit of rattle that reminds you these are indeed full-floaters.

They do perform as advertised in improving overall braking performance while significantly reducing that distortion tendency. :)
 

SilverBullet

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scott123007 said:
Full floating rotors, were designed to reduce the tendency towards thermal stress induced distortion due to uneven thermal expansion under load. Prior to the introduction (by Brembo) of this design, brake rotors in the motorcycle industry were simply round discs bolted solidly to the wheel. You may remember if you've been around long enough, the rotors on the early CB750 and Z-1's were nearly 7mm thick and weighed accordingly. This was in effort to keep them from warping. Now days, the only road bikes coming through with solid mount (front) brakes are the Cruisers and budget bikes.

True full-floaters move on the carriers, this allows them to self-center in the caliper for reduced brake drag and "float" unimpeded for unrestricted expansion and contraction during repeated thermal cycling. The only serious down side is a bit of rattle that reminds you these are indeed full-floaters.

They do perform as advertised in improving overall braking performance while significantly reducing that distortion tendency. :)
I thought that sounded familar. I had Googled it and read the following link two days ago.
http://www.braketech.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=70:what-is-full-floating&catid=17:tech-talk&Itemid=69

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scott123007

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SilverBullet

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SilverBullet said:
^ this ^

I beat on the rotor for a good hour and made a huge improvement but couldn't get it perfect. Gave up as I think a problem also with that impacted puck and I didn't want to waste more time on it. If it was a non floating rotor I could have fixed it. Brakes now 50% better and very little pump up needed but still go back down so bike will sit until PartsFish.com delivers the new rotor next week. Good news is based on the partial straightening and corresponding improvement in brakes I know definitely the rotor is the cause.

Thanks everyone for the replies, ideas and help.
Realized I never posted back after replacing the rotor so for complete closure on this thread that did solve my issue. I hate finding a problem thread without a definitive ending.

And now on a related note was out riding this weekend and we did some off road that was probably a full pay grade more than the S10 should be subjected to. The other Tenere in attendance hit his front rotor on something without dropping and lost his brakes the same as I did. When we returned to the campsite he tried straightening it with the same partial results as my attempt. Funny hadn't read much about this issue but now definitely something we need to watch out for. Those front rotors are so close to the ground and no practical way to add protection for them.

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Don in Lodi

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Just a little too much Goat in your Goat Trails. ::005::
 
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