Front brakes not working smoothly?

[RicoChet]

Hey Guys. So with spring just getting here, I was able to get my bike out for a real ride this weekend. I've noticed that the rear brake has very smooth and linear response, but my front brakes have a weird... well I don't want to say pulsing because I know what that feels like, but its more like smooth, then bump, smooth then bump. The bike rides superbly smooth when riding normally but when front brakes are applied I can feel kind of like a uneven braking feel when light on the brakes. When hard on the brakes you obviously dont feel it too much but when lightly braking its kind of annoying, first bike I've owned that did this. Its a 2016 with 18K on it, do you think it has a warped rotor? Uneven brake pads? I know if it was a warped rotor or something the pulsing would be even and kind of feel like how I car steering wheel moves back and forth when its not aligned right. Any advice?

 

[Dogdaze]

First, take off the calipers, re-insert the pads and squeeze the lever, this will push the pistons out but not too far, also have a look to see if all the pistons come out at the same rate.
Clean all of the pistons, I used a tooth brush and twine dipped in brake cleaner to get in the tight bit, imagine flossing.
Do not push the pistons back in until they are spit clean!!
Then move the rotors to see if they 'click' when attempting to rotate, if not the bobbins / rivets are seized, they need to rotate freely. Our rotors are semi-floaters. Have a look at youtube, lots of methods to clean them, scotchpad clean all the rotors too. See if that improves them.
In truth, it's most likely build up of brake dust, but on the rare occasion that rotors are warped ( mine were, as they were bent when I had the tyres changes, because they laid them on the ground).

 

[limey]

Remember this bike has unified brakes so when you operate the front the rear is being used at the same time.

 

[RicoChet]

Remember this bike has unified brakes so when you operate the front the rear is being used at the same time.

That I do but Ive used linked brakes before on other bikes like My St1300 and they were liquid smooth, the front brakes on this bike are not smooth, they're "Lumpy" feeling with soft braking. Rear Brake is like butter! That's why im just trying to find out if warped rotors or worn out brake pads or somethign can contribue to lumpy feeling breaking, I've felt how worn rotors feels on a car when it makes yoru steering wheel vibrate left and right but in this case its just something liek this -----------LUMP-----------LUMP-----------LUMP

 

[Checkswrecks]

Being a Canookian, my guess is that you don't always ride in sunshine and that you've got a little grunge built up on either the pistons or the pins in the calipers.


On the up-side, your bike is so new it ought to be a warranty item.

 

[RicoChet]

Being a Canookian, my guess is that you don't always ride in sunshine and that you've got a little grunge built up on either the pistons or the pins in the calipers.


On the up-side, your bike is so new it ought to be a warranty item.

Why would that make it feel lumpy though? Just curious... trying to learn. If I am applying constant pressure but still getting the lump, how would the grunge accomplish that? I am almost wondering if maybe the tires or even suspect, but they ride smooth. When the weather is better I'll be taking it into a dealership to get an oil change and the "Once Over" since i havent had that done since I bought it second hand and would just make sure all is well. The only other way I could describe it is like one part of the rotor was worn or dirty and every single rotation you could feel it in the brakes. The lever doesn't feel it though, just the braking itself.

 

[blitz11]

How are the steering head bearing? Slightly loose steering head bearings may create the "lumpy" feel, especially if you don't feel it through the brake lever.

If you're just using the rear brake, you're not loading the front end, and you'd be less likely to feel the lumps.

 

[Dogdaze]

Clean the calipers, rotors, check the head bearings (as been suggested, good call) and perhaps the tyre, that is also a likely cause if the type of tyre you#re using has nobblies, maybe one or two have worn unevenly......... DO the simple obvious, easily accessed items first.

 

[WJBertrand]

I had this exact same problem at similar mileage (19K). I too noticed the uneven stopping, especially as you let up slightly on the brakes as you stop, the bike would surge often forcing me to change which foot I was about to put down. Also, at high speeds the front brakes felt coarse or rough and lacked stopping power. My point of comparison is also an ST1300. I got quite a bit of runaround from the dealer and Yamaha but eventually they warrantied the front rotors (but made me pay for new pads). That completely solved the problem. Once fixed, I realized the problem went all the way back to when the bike was new, it was a completely different bike after the front rotors were replaced. I have a friend with a '16 FJR who had the same complaint and ended up with the same fix as for mine. I think Yamaha got a bad run of rotors from whomever their supplier is. My bike is now at 29K and no further problems.

 

[RicoChet]

I had this exact same problem at similar mileage (19K). I too noticed the uneven stopping, especially as you let up slightly on the brakes as you stop, the bike would surge often forcing me to change which foot I was about to put down. Also, at high speeds the front brakes felt coarse or rough and lacked stopping power. My point of comparison is also an ST1300. I got quite a bit of runaround from the dealer and Yamaha but eventually they warrantied the front rotors (but made me pay for new pads). That completely solved the problem. Once fixed, I realized the problem went all the way back to when the bike was new, it was a completely different bike after the front rotors were replaced. I have a friend with a '16 FJR who had the same complaint and ended up with the same fix as for mine. I think Yamaha got a bad run of rotors from whomever their supplier is. My bike is now at 29K and no further problems.

That sounds promising! I will definitely have it checked out by the dealer. Yeah, its not nice having a new bike and realizing somethign is not right with the brake feel. I've owned many and this is the first I've felt something like this. Luckily for me, the previous owner of my bike bought 4 years extended Yamaha Warranty so if it is a serviceable item I will definitely take advantage of it. One of the great joys of riding a fancy bike is the way it performs while braking. The ST1300 was amazing for this. My previous Rocket III Roadster, not so much with 800lbs of weight!!

 

[WJBertrand]

That sounds promising! I will definitely have it checked out by the dealer. Yeah, its not nice having a new bike and realizing something's not right with the brake feel. I've owned many and this is the first I've felt something like this. Luckily for me, the previous owner of my bike bought 4 years extended Yamaha Warranty so if it is a serviceable item I will definitely take advantage of it. One of the great joys of riding a fancy bike is the way it performs while braking. The ST1300 was amazing for this. My previous Rocket III Roadster, not so much with 800lbs of weight!!

They will try to deflect any claim that brakes are considered wear items but I was able to argue that they were defective and it wasn't a case of wear. After all the front pads hadn't even been replaced yet and appeared to have a lot of meat left on them. (I insisted they give the original pads back to me as I had to pay for the new ones) After they finally covered it as "good will" gesture, I realized it was truly a case of defective parts because with the new rotors, the bike braked much more smoothly than it had, even when it was new.

Also I tried all the other suggestions above and though they are worthwhile, none of those ideas solved the problem in my case.

 

[Don in Lodi]

I'm with Jeff, something went wrong with the 'floating' portion of the rotors. We had a gent that clipped a rock with one of the floating pucks and jammed things up. The front calipers are fixed, the floating rotor usually takes up any run-out of the disk, seize a puck, all bets are off.

 

[~TABASCO~]

I had a similar issue back in 2012... I had two brake seals that were 'rolled' in the bore.. Yamaha replaced the seals and wipers, fixed it ! If it gets that far, maybe check those out.

 

[Bigbore4]

Don't forget the ABS. If you hit a small sharp bump under braking, enough to lift the tire, the ABS will cycle just for a moment. It can give the symptom you describe.

 

[WJBertrand]

Don't forget the ABS. If you hit a small sharp bump under braking, enough to lift the tire, the ABS will cycle just for a moment. It can give the symptom you describe.

In my case the "coarse" feel on braking was obvious way before ABS kicked in and felt to be much higher frequency, it was also continuous rather than existing for just a moment. Also how does one explain the surging feeling as one comes to a stop whilst reducing brake pressure if it's ABS. My front brakes behavior was classically symptomatic of a warped rotor or two. I suppose it could have been down to the floating system but I was able to rotate the little tubes that link the carrier to the rotor with a little effort. Maybe they were too tight but they weren't seized.

 

[RicoChet]

Don't forget the ABS. If you hit a small sharp bump under braking, enough to lift the tire, the ABS will cycle just for a moment. It can give the symptom you describe.

Very familiar with ABS and how it feels but we are talking about extremely, extremely gradual and light braking which is when it is most noticeable. I would describe it as "Warped Rotors" as well but I am not a mechanic, so I will have it checked out by one!

 

[Cycledude]

Have you been doing any riding it dirty wet sloppy conditions ? Like others have suggested I would start by removing and seriously cleaning all the brake calipers.

 

[RicoChet]

Have you been doing any riding it dirty wet sloppy conditions ? Like others have suggested I would start by removing and seriously cleaning all the brake calipers.

Brand new bike to me, I've only rode it 5 times since November... I have no technical skills to do what your mentioning so I will book an appt with a dealership.

 

[cyclemike4]

hello there. I just had to reply to this issue. My bike has the exact same problem and I went through all the same things that they have been telling you. I even bought a new rotor out of my pocket even though the bike was only a year old at the time. I replaced the worst one but still had issues. The problem on my bike was really crappy rotors. They do not like bad weather and the surface will rust easily especially under the brake pad when you stop for the night and the rotor is wet. By all means do all the right checks to make sure your brakes are working properly but in the end I bet you will need to clean and re glaze the rotor as I call it. I find that on my bike when it does what you are describing I can find a nice clean empty road put the bike in second gear ( that is what I use) pull the front brake on hard and gas the bike hard for about a 100 yards to put heat in the pads and rotors then let all the way off and run the bike a bit to cool things off then repeat. It is about the same thing as breaking in new rotors. This doesn't always completely get rid of that feeling but it takes %99 of it out if not all of it. I ride year round in bad weather and usually I am very easy on brakes. This adds to the effect no doubt. Hope this helps. Been there and done that!

 

[RicoChet]

Just got a call back from the Dealership -- I brought my bike in a few days ago for a full service and inspection. They told me the brakes are fixed now "The calipers were filthy"

So apparently that was what it took to fix them. I am curious though, why would dirty calipers make the brakes feel juddery? Aren't the calipers just the pieces that hold the brake pads and pistons? Wouldn't it make more sense if lets say the pads were dirty or if there was dirt on the rotors? Just trying to understand how a dirty caliper makes brakes feel bad.. I tried doing a google search but most of the results came back with different issues.