Tipping. It’s getting out of hand.

EricV

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The problem is partly the American culture of no amount of profit is enough, more is always sought. Yes, employers should pay a decent wage, but they often don't. People still need jobs and sadly, there are a lot of people that lack the skills and education to get better jobs in their area, so will take what ever they can get. Sometimes working 2, 3 or even 4 jobs. edit - Obama didn't help, requiring employers to give benefits to anyone working over 30 hours/week. All this did is cause employers to limit part time employee hours to 29 hrs/week so they didn't have to pay benefits. I saw this first hand. Just limit hours and hire more part time employees. So the 'part time' employees that used to work 50-60 hr/wk now work 29 and have to get a second job working 25-29 Hrs/wk somewhere else.

When I lived in OR the State Minimum wage was always increasing in an attempt to be a living wage relative to the cost of living. Currently it's $11.25/Hr.

Here in MS, the land of slavery, people are still slaves. The State Prisons are having a hard time getting guards. The guard to prisoner ratio in LA next door is 1 guard to 5 prisoners. Here it's 1 guard to 23 prisoners, unheard of in this type of field. And that's not some minimum security feather bed prison, it's a the high risk, full of gangs shit holes. Here's the kicker, they are paying $7.28/Hr for prison guards. (They just claimed to have increased wages to that amount. They hope to increase wages by 3% next year for guards. A whole 22 cents/Hr.) You can make more at a fast food restaurant. State minimum wage in MS is $7.25/Hr.

Things are cheaper here, (one of the reasons I retired here), but not THAT much cheaper. A typical 1 bedroom apt runs $500-$700. You can't find much of anything under $500/Mo and the $500/Mo apartments aren't very nice or in nice areas. So out of your minimum wage earnings, you're paying around 60% of your net income for a roof over your head, often more. The consumer mentality of young people I see means that most of what's left is likely going to a car payment. Though I think that's a little less common here than it was in UT or OR where I lived in the past.

UT has a state minimum wage of $7.25/Hr too, but entry level employees at McDonalds were making closer to $10/Hr. Federal minimum wage is $7.25 so these states are only keeping up with the Fed requirement, not making any effort to ensure that their citizens make a livable wage.

I was making $60k/Yr as a skilled machinist in Oregon in '11. When I moved to UT the same job was paying $30k/Yr. with crap benefits that didn't even cover my wife. I took at job as a City Parks employee because it paid the same, but had terrific benefits that covered both my wife and I.

Most of the city jobs here in Tupelo pay less than $30k/Yr. Minimum wage here would be a gross income of $15,080/Yr. Most of the city jobs start at around $23k/Yr.

If you were making $15k/Yr would you be hoping for tips if there was any way you could get them? You bet you would.

Yes, employers should be paying a living wage. Many simply don't, because they don't have to. Either by Federal law or because the market is full of unskilled workers that they can always prey upon and more unemployed workers than jobs.

Sadly, despite people working hard to get better jobs through education, skill development, etc, those low paying jobs will always exist as long as employers can pay low wages. Someone has to do those jobs.

In MS some of the more unpleasant jobs are in the chicken processing plants. 7 of the larger ones were recently busted in huge illegal immigration busts. 700 plus people arrested as illegal immigrants. About half were released in short order. Others may be detained or deported. The towns where those people lived are near empty. The raids were done just after school started, so many of the children got out of school later that day to come home to empty homes with no parents around. Or worse, no one picked them up at school for the young ones. People were taking them in to shelter and feed them. Most of those children are US citizens, having been born here. (argue that some other time please)

None of the employers or their management were charged with anything.

Those employers were recruiting in Mexico, getting work visas for those people and bringing them into the US to work for them. They provided no housing assistance, only paid them wages. Then when the work visas expired, the employer wouldn't assist them in renewing the work visas. (captive employees, can't get other jobs because they don't have work visas and are then illegals). Because of this, years later, for some decades later, they are classed as illegal immigrants during these types of raids.

Paints a bit of a different picture. The chicken processing plants aren't having much luck hiring new people because they pay minimum wage and the jobs suck. I'd bet they go right back to doing what they did before, recruiting in Mexico, getting work visas, the ignoring their employees once the work visa expires so they can keep them captive. After all, they were not prosecuted for doing it the last time, so why not just keep doing it?
 
B

ballisticexchris

Guest
I agree 100% with the title of this thread tipping is getting way out of line.
Bottom line is you will only make as much as the market will bear. I would prefer to farm out my work to overseas workers who actually have a good work ethic. I can care less about a "living wage". In our culture the average American is a lazy piece of crap.

It is proven with this thread title "Tipping, it's getting out of hand". Lazy bums looking for a free handout. For this reason alone I feel an employer has no obligation nor should ever have to pay a "living wage".

BTW I applaud ICE for their effort to rid our country from these hardened criminals from the processing plants. The only mistake they made was letting the next generation of "anchor babies" stay. They should have rounded up every singe man woman and child and bused them to the South end of Gordon Wells road. Of course I would get them a meal at Duners Diner before dumping them off.
 

EricV

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Posting just to stir the pot isn't really appreciated. This forum has in the past been pretty good about avoiding this type of behavior. I don't see any benefit in posting things just to attempt to get people riled up. Some people might take your post seriously, in which case that paints a ugly picture of your personality. This is the Lounge, but I have mentioned several times before, satire doesn't play well. Or have any purpose, IMHO.
 

Boris

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Dec 21, 2013
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midlands. UK
Come to Oz. We hardly ever tip. The US tipping culture is spreading around the world like a disease. Not required outside the US generally but I am happy to tip in the USA as I like the service in bars and restaurants. Not so much for looking at my bag.

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I’ve just booked a flight to QLD for later in the year. Tipping protocol noted.

Ta
 

wjfawb0

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Jul 14, 2019
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Chattanooga, TN
I just want folks who visit the USA to know that you can avoid all that tipping the bell boy crap by travelling and staying in more rural areas of the US. If you're going to a city for work or tourist traps, then you're probably going to have to deal with it. I'll fight the parking and luggage folks at hotels. I'm not paying for that, and they're not carrying my stuff. I don't like bean water, so no starbucks for me.
 

Sierra1

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Nov 7, 2016
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Joshua TX
I just want folks who visit the USA to know that you can avoid all that tipping the bell boy crap by travelling and staying in more rural areas of the US....
I'm not sure "rural" is the key, but yeah, if you're going to stay somewhere that has a bell boy....then you've likely made the choice, and expect the extra cost. My main concern is that they appear, and smell clean; I would never think about breaking out the black light. I've stayed in some questionable places, sometimes 'cuz it was all I could afford, and sometimes because I hadn't planned ahead, and it was all that was left. My tipping is always a case by case decision. More service....more tip.
 

squarebore

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Apr 22, 2013
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Sunshine Coast, Queensland, Australia
I’ve just booked a flight to QLD for later in the year. Tipping protocol noted.

Ta
Where are you headed in QLD? I'm on the sunshine coast. Yeah some will ask for tips but it is never "required". If they know you are from the US they will hope/expect tips. Aussies don't generally tip in australia unless it is exceptional service.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
 
B

ballisticexchris

Guest
Bottom line is you will only make as much as the market will bear. I would prefer to farm out my work to overseas workers who actually have a good work ethic. I can care less about a "living wage". In our culture the average American is a lazy piece of crap.

It is proven with this thread title "Tipping, it's getting out of hand". Lazy bums looking for a free handout. For this reason alone I feel an employer has no obligation nor should ever have to pay a "living wage".

BTW I applaud ICE for their effort to rid our country from these hardened criminals from the processing plants. The only mistake they made was letting the next generation of "anchor babies" stay. They should have rounded up every single man woman and child and bused them to the South end of Gordon Wells road. Of course I would get them a meal at Duners Diner before dumping them off.
Posting just to stir the pot isn't really appreciated. This forum has in the past been pretty good about avoiding this type of behavior. I don't see any benefit in posting things just to attempt to get people riled up. Some people might take your post seriously, in which case that paints a ugly picture of your personality. This is the Lounge, but I have mentioned several times before, satire doesn't play well. Or have any purpose, IMHO.
No "stirring up the pot" at all. I stand by my comments above. That's the problem with our country. Most Americans don't want to be honest and truthful. I'm willing to bet that a good percentage of hard working citizens would agree with me. Unfortunately not many Americans want to work hard. Thus the tipping to supplement the laziness to work hard for a better paying job. Hell, I'm not making a fortune in my industry. But I'm not begging for a tip either.

Have any of you ever been to the South end of Gordon Wells Road? I have. It's a perfect drop off point for illegal criminals, spouses and their future criminal offspring to be sent back to Mexico. This is a perfect time of the year for a nice hike back home. If they decide to change their mind, they are welcome to hike back through the dunes back to America.
 

Boris

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Joined
Dec 21, 2013
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midlands. UK
Where are you headed in QLD? I'm on the sunshine coast. Yeah some will ask for tips but it is never "required". If they know you are from the US they will hope/expect tips. Aussies don't generally tip in australia unless it is exceptional service.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
I’m heading to Cleveland just south of Brisbane, but will be visiting Bribie and possibly Mooloolaba, which I guess is your way.
 

Tenman

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Joined
Dec 7, 2013
Messages
2,102
Location
Natchez Ms USA
The problem is partly the American culture of no amount of profit is enough, more is always sought. Yes, employers should pay a decent wage, but they often don't. People still need jobs and sadly, there are a lot of people that lack the skills and education to get better jobs in their area, so will take what ever they can get. Sometimes working 2, 3 or even 4 jobs. edit - Obama didn't help, requiring employers to give benefits to anyone working over 30 hours/week. All this did is cause employers to limit part time employee hours to 29 hrs/week so they didn't have to pay benefits. I saw this first hand. Just limit hours and hire more part time employees. So the 'part time' employees that used to work 50-60 hr/wk now work 29 and have to get a second job working 25-29 Hrs/wk somewhere else.

When I lived in OR the State Minimum wage was always increasing in an attempt to be a living wage relative to the cost of living. Currently it's $11.25/Hr.

Here in MS, the land of slavery, people are still slaves. The State Prisons are having a hard time getting guards. The guard to prisoner ratio in LA next door is 1 guard to 5 prisoners. Here it's 1 guard to 23 prisoners, unheard of in this type of field. And that's not some minimum security feather bed prison, it's a the high risk, full of gangs shit holes. Here's the kicker, they are paying $7.28/Hr for prison guards. (They just claimed to have increased wages to that amount. They hope to increase wages by 3% next year for guards. A whole 22 cents/Hr.) You can make more at a fast food restaurant. State minimum wage in MS is $7.25/Hr.

Things are cheaper here, (one of the reasons I retired here), but not THAT much cheaper. A typical 1 bedroom apt runs $500-$700. You can't find much of anything under $500/Mo and the $500/Mo apartments aren't very nice or in nice areas. So out of your minimum wage earnings, you're paying around 60% of your net income for a roof over your head, often more. The consumer mentality of young people I see means that most of what's left is likely going to a car payment. Though I think that's a little less common here than it was in UT or OR where I lived in the past.

UT has a state minimum wage of $7.25/Hr too, but entry level employees at McDonalds were making closer to $10/Hr. Federal minimum wage is $7.25 so these states are only keeping up with the Fed requirement, not making any effort to ensure that their citizens make a livable wage.

I was making $60k/Yr as a skilled machinist in Oregon in '11. When I moved to UT the same job was paying $30k/Yr. with crap benefits that didn't even cover my wife. I took at job as a City Parks employee because it paid the same, but had terrific benefits that covered both my wife and I.

Most of the city jobs here in Tupelo pay less than $30k/Yr. Minimum wage here would be a gross income of $15,080/Yr. Most of the city jobs start at around $23k/Yr.

If you were making $15k/Yr would you be hoping for tips if there was any way you could get them? You bet you would.

Yes, employers should be paying a living wage. Many simply don't, because they don't have to. Either by Federal law or because the market is full of unskilled workers that they can always prey upon and more unemployed workers than jobs.

Sadly, despite people working hard to get better jobs through education, skill development, etc, those low paying jobs will always exist as long as employers can pay low wages. Someone has to do those jobs.

In MS some of the more unpleasant jobs are in the chicken processing plants. 7 of the larger ones were recently busted in huge illegal immigration busts. 700 plus people arrested as illegal immigrants. About half were released in short order. Others may be detained or deported. The towns where those people lived are near empty. The raids were done just after school started, so many of the children got out of school later that day to come home to empty homes with no parents around. Or worse, no one picked them up at school for the young ones. People were taking them in to shelter and feed them. Most of those children are US citizens, having been born here. (argue that some other time please)

None of the employers or their management were charged with anything.

Those employers were recruiting in Mexico, getting work visas for those people and bringing them into the US to work for them. They provided no housing assistance, only paid them wages. Then when the work visas expired, the employer wouldn't assist them in renewing the work visas. (captive employees, can't get other jobs because they don't have work visas and are then illegals). Because of this, years later, for some decades later, they are classed as illegal immigrants during these types of raids.

Paints a bit of a different picture. The chicken processing plants aren't having much luck hiring new people because they pay minimum wage and the jobs suck. I'd bet they go right back to doing what they did before, recruiting in Mexico, getting work visas, the ignoring their employees once the work visa expires so they can keep them captive. After all, they were not prosecuted for doing it the last time, so why not just keep doing it?
I saw on the Jackson Ms. news where citizens were lined up wanting those chicken farm jobs. The owners of those chicken farms and processing plants need to be arrested for aiding illegal actions. As far as tipping goes. If you do a good job you will getem. If you don't. You shouldn't. I will not eat at a place that adds tips to my bill automaticlly. Giving big tips to useless people causes them to get worse and can drag everybody down.
 

Tenman

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Joined
Dec 7, 2013
Messages
2,102
Location
Natchez Ms USA
I tip at least 25% worldwide regardless of how good of service I get. At Starbucks and fast food I give 50% tip. Those who give less than 20% are just cheap bastards.

At supermarkets I give a 20 spot to the kid who bags my groceries.

At gas stations I give 5-10 bucks to the attendant to offset the price of cheap fuel. I’m fortunate enough to live in a state where gas prices are dirt cheap.
Your profile says you are in Ca. Never heard anybody from there say they had cheap gas.
 
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