S10 not running, strange thing happening

Evilwerkz

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Sep 13, 2018
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Hi everyone, new to the forum, been reading about the hard start problems........but let me tell you what my S10 is doing

Background, 2013 S10 with 23k miles, all stock, PO bought the S10 with 12k miles and in two months rode from Chicago to Canada to California and added 11k more miles and sold it to me at the end of his trip, had regular services donde on the road every 3 to 4k miles, last service done in Vancouver, BC, before that in British springs...etc

I bought it from him exactly one month ago, and new I would be doing the valve check and whatnot fairly soon, he assured me the S10 never gave him any problems, so I bought it, rode it 3 times, it felt fine, and decided to park it untill I could import it into Mexico, wich I just did 3 days ago

3 days ago, all excited to ride it, changed oil and filter, and ordered plugs, air filter and new battery, just in case.....went to turn it on, nothing......what? hard start? did all the hard start procedures, hooked it up to a car battery to help the dying yuasa battery.......nothing, what the hell, removed the gas tank, and found missing screws, the air box lid was being held with 2 screws..........

so I removed everything I could, cleaned everything, took the plugs out and burned the excess carbon and oil, rinsed with carb spray........crank it, and nothing, fuel pump turns on, disconeccted hose, turned Key and fuel flows for a few seconds, and the flow looks good

Soooo, removed the motobatt from my other MC, replaced it on the S10 ( dang, that battery has big cojones :eek::D, glad I ordered a new one for this S10 ) but no luck.....

So I went ballistics, removed and super cleaned every single positive and negative terminal just in case there was corrosion......no luck......so i said, you know what? fuck it......STARTING FLUID :mad:o_O:eek::eek:......

sprayed some starter fluid on rubber stacks, turned ignition on, cranked it.......and it turned on, for about 3 seconds, and died.............did it again, but now I also had gasoline on a spray bottle, turned on, and kept it going for about 10 seconds spraying gas on the rubber stack....WTF????

So am I dealing here, with a faulty fuel pump or regulator? not enough pressure for the inyectors to engage? or maybe dead inyectors? I'm going to go to an Inyector cleaning business around here and have them clean and diagnose the inyectors......

Sorry for the long post, but if I'm missing something or if you have any input, it would be greatly appreciated.....

side note, do these bikes start when on the center stand? where is the tip over sensor located so I can diagnose it? thanks
 

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Gigitt

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Center stand is Ok for starting.
But check side stand switch, was the side stand up when trying to start? was it in Neutral?

OK so you are getting no cranking...
Do you hear relays clicking when you push start button? if no then start button may need to be opened and cleaned with contact cleaner, or starter relay is stuck.
Try to pull fuses to re-seat the contacts.
 

steve68steve

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Not an expert, but missing a bunch of airbox screws? Spraying fuel on the "rubber stacks"? Is that the rubber boot that connects the airbox to the throttle bodies?

If so, it sounds like a big air leak. The "not an expert" part comes in here: this bike is fuel injected and fueling is governed by an ECU that relies on sensors and metering to hit the right stoichiometry for operation. If you are introducing a huge amount of extra, unexpected-by-the-ECU air, that might hamper ignition. Spraying fuel would be increasing the fuel in addition to that provided by the pump, so would combat a problem of extra air.

Again, I don't WTF I'm talking about - just a thought, worth what you paid for it.
 

EricV

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If he was getting it to run briefly by spraying starting fluid and gas into the intake, I'm going to guess it cranks ok, just doesn't catch.

Fuel, Air, Spark. These three things in the proper ratio make an engine run. So, you appear to have spark, the question is do you have air and fuel in the proper ratios and are their electronic issues.

There is an intake air sensor located in the right side of the air box. Is it plugged in? People often forget to plug this in when removing the air box for service work. The bike won't run w/o a signal there.

Have you checked the diagnostic codes? How to check diagnostic codes That's for Gen I bikes like your 2013.

How long did the fuel squirt when you tried that? Just a little, or as long as you left the key on?

Are the throttle body to air box clamps tight? Vacuum caps in place on the right side TB and nothing loose or un-plugged on either side?

Have you pulled the fuel pump out of the tank to check the sock filter? It's the only fuel filter on the bike. You will need to carefully remove the pump, which can be done with a little care, or you can separate the two halves to get it all the way out. When you put it back into the tank, be CAREFUL to get the rubber quad ring correctly seated w/o twisting it or otherwise damaging it. It's not that hard, you just need to pay attention.

Check these things and get back to us. It's probably something simple, not the classic hard start problem or worse.
 

Don in Lodi

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There's a set of little diode lights called Noid lights, they plug into a two wire circuit to determine if your getting an on/off signal on your injector harness. You can use a test light on the injector harness to check for signal too. A bit more fiddly, attach to the positive cable and check for a ground signal, either switching or steady, hook to the negative cable and check for signal, again, either steady or switching. Usually the positive is steady and the ecu uses the ground for switching. If you can probe the pins in the plug without distorting them, you can use the test light from one wire on the plug to the other and get a light pulse. You've got spark, you've got fuel available, is the fuel high enough pressure, and is it able to get in the motor. I think air is probably ok.
 

Cycledude

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How much gas is in the tank ? I’ve run across a few folks trying to figure out why something wouldn’t start when the only real problem was not enough fuel in the tank.
 

EricV

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Just looked at the pic, no air box, no ambient air temp sensor plugged in. It will NOT start w/o the sensor plugged in and all the airbox stuff removed.
 

Evilwerkz

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Thank you all for your Replies, the Pic that I uploaded is how the SuperTenere is sitting right now, no ECU ( sending it to avc8130 to get it reflashed ), no Airbox , took it off to acces the inyectors, had them cleaned today, the guy that did it said they where perfect and in sync when inyecting

when I tested it, the atmosferic sensor on the airbox was on, just the top of the airbox removed so I could manually spray gas into the intakes
S10 on center stand, side stand up, and in neutral

14 liters of gas in the tank, when I disconnected the hose from the tank and turned the key, it squirted gas into a bottle for maybe about 2-3 seconds and then stopped, and about 100 milliliters of gas went into the bottle

vaccum line on left side connected to sensor, little cap on the right TB is on and no cracks, clamps on TB to airbox are tight, no foreigns bodies down the intakes and are really clean internally, rear of valves look good ( usb micro camera )

I'm going to put it all back together once again before I send the ECU off, I will disconnect and clean with contact cleaner all the connectors I find, and will give it a go with fresh gas, if no go, then I'll put it in Diagnostic mode and go from there, the NOID light sounds interesting

Again, thank you for taking your time to anwser this post, will let you guys know how it goes :)
 

EricV

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Try and check for codes when you have the ECU plugged in, and clear them, then give the start attempt another go. After that, if it doesn't start, check the codes again and see what came back. They often point in the direction of the problem.
 

2daMax

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If all is good for the checks, did u remember if your previous successful starts, did you hear loud rattling that last a few seconds and then go away?

Thinking of a bad CCT that may have allowed the timing chain to jump.
 

steve68steve

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If all is good for the checks, did u remember if your previous successful starts, did you hear loud rattling that last a few seconds and then go away?

Thinking of a bad CCT that may have allowed the timing chain to jump.
OP: compression check will determine if this is your issue.
 

OldRider

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If all is good for the checks, did u remember if your previous successful starts, did you hear loud rattling that last a few seconds and then go away?

Thinking of a bad CCT that may have allowed the timing chain to jump.
But he said it runs if he sprays gas into the intake.
 

EricV

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If all is good for the checks, did u remember if your previous successful starts, did you hear loud rattling that last a few seconds and then go away?

Thinking of a bad CCT that may have allowed the timing chain to jump.
23k miles is VERY low for this to happen. Not impossible, but completely un-heard of. Especially before it's ever had a valve service.
 

Dogdaze

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Has the little rubber boot / cap on the throttle body been checked, these crack over time and have been know to allow air into the system.....
 

EricV

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Has the little rubber boot / cap on the throttle body been checked, these crack over time and have been know to allow air into the system.....
Yes, he mentions it above and I referenced it in my first post to this thread.
 
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