Offroading with Hard Sided Panniers - bang, clang, boom!

DamonS

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Apr 27, 2021
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89
Location
Ontario, Canada
a question for those who ride spirited offroad, single track or other questionably uneven surfaces that use hard sided panniers....

What packing strategy do you use to keep things from bouncing around or shifting, especially when the pannier isn't full.
I keep my tools, and air pump and my medkit and various essentials in the panniers, obviously it takes up a small portion of the space, but they are not soft spongey items.. i'm thinking of compartmentalizing them, or incorporating some sort of ladder system so i can put bungees over it depending on the height requirements, so there is no way for them to bounce around but still give me freedom to add more on top in varying quantities..
the easy solution is to just stuff soft crap in there like clothes, bike covers or camping gear, but once i've unloaded those soft items at camp and want to explore i don't wnat to pack it up again just for a spirited dirt romp.

do any of you have any strategies to keep the heavy loose essentials in place? looking for ideas, want to tinker a bit and see what inspiration arises.
 

SkunkWorks

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Sep 13, 2018
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1,733
Location
Colorado
I leave mine at Camp, and use a "Tail-Bag" for smaller quantity items that I take on my day-rides.
I usually cable-lock them to a picnic-table if there is one, or sometimes just to themselves in my tent.

I can flatten this tail-bag down when I'm not using it, so it doesn't hardly take up any space.
It will hold two 5-lb bags of ice if I need it to!
IMG_0050.JPG
 

Checkswrecks

Ungenear to broked stuff
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I have hard boxes for riding on the road and usually on gravel. But I won't ride challenging gravel or real off road with them since meeting a RTW KLR owner who had the hard box break his lower leg in Mexico.

From the ADV thread on hard vs soft bags leading to broken legs:

[2Squirrely, post: 36531991, member: 337769]
It seems that people are treating the pannier = broken leg thing as a "myth." I feel strongly enough about this make my first post in years....

Three weeks ago I got a little too aggressive on a cold tire. I spun the rear tire on my VStrom exiting a parking lot on dry 35deg day. The bike fishtailed twice. I instinctively stood, and dabbed a foot to straighten out oscillation. My right pannier (a huge 1440 Pelican box) hit me in the right calf, pinned it to the asphalt, tore my leg apart and pulled the bike and I to the ground. I stood up right away to check on the bike. The leg wobbled when I stood on it and I almost fell over again. I also felt a terrible grinding feeling, so I sat to investigate. While I sat on my butt and held the knee upright, my foot fell over sideways independent of my knee!!!! So I straightened it and held in in place until the ambulance could come.

Results: a big spiral fractured plus a half-dozen other "butterfly fractures" of the Tib, and a cleanly broken Fib. ...ambulance ride, 5 hrs surgery, stainless steel plate, 20 screws, 40 stitches, and 8 weeks in a cast/crutches. Doc says I have good strong bones, but that they're no match for blunt-force-trauma that the pannier caused.

This all happened in a split second at 20mph on dry pavement. I'm experienced: 30+ year rider who's had dozens of bikes and raced moto, enduro, desert, etc. I commute 10-15000 mi/yr in all weather on the street. I was wearing good gear: Sidi Armada GTX boots and Aerostich Darien GTX pants over street cloths.

The myth is real. I didn't think it would happen to me... especially on an under-powered street bike, but it can and did. Soft panniers for me from now on. (And perhaps I'll grow-up a bit and save the aggressive stuff for the dirt... )

PS: the last pic is what "fracture blisters" look like. Apparently these paper-thin surface blood blisters form near severe fractures, and make an exciting little bonus surprise when your cast comes off at your follow-up visit. []
 

RCinNC

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Aug 30, 2014
Messages
2,816
Location
North Carolina
My strategy is not to keep tools in the panniers. My tool bag and air compressor are stored in a tool tube attached to the inside of my right pannier rack.



For other items, like a first aid kit, I would keep in a soft bag attached to each crash bar. In my case, the soft bags hold two sets of rain gear, a tire plug kit, and a set of mini jumper cables. The bags are made from a couple of military surplus gas mask carriers.



The goal for me is to not need the panniers if I'm out riding, unless I'm actually touring. If I deliberately went out for a day of bombing around on dirt and such, I wouldn't take the hard panniers. If I was touring and the tour was going to include a lot of off the pavement stuff, I'd use my soft panniers.

But, if you're set on carrying stuff like tool kits inside your panniers, my recommendation is that you go get some items called Footman's Loops. They look like this:



You could mount them on the inside of your panniers, and then you could secure your toolbag, first aid kit, etc to the footman's loops using velcro tape or quick release straps. That way they'd still be inside the panniers, but would be lashed down tight and wouldn't bounce around. If they got in the way, they're easy enough to unbolt and remove.
 

Sierra1

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Nov 7, 2016
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14,812
Location
Joshua TX
I use towels as padding/stuffing when I have things in my boxes that I don't want bouncing around. I don't do off road, but my paved roads are every bit as bumpy. If I end up putting additional things in the boxes, I remove the towels as needed. Since I always have a couple of bungees, the extra towels can be secured easily. As a bonus, the extra towels always come in handy when camping.

My EDC bag is similar to Alan's, just not as large. Just a Harbor Freight canvas tool bag that bungees easy to the seat. It carries my gym clothes, extra mags, tourniquet, phone, wallet, etc.
 

Mak10

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Aug 20, 2018
Messages
2,567
Location
SE Idaho
I’ve ridden with guys who have gotten hurt with hard panniers, soft panniers ( hard stuff inside, cook kit, foldable shovel) and no panniers (Hard panniers would have prevented Snert from breaking his leg).

Good boots, are well worth the $$$ in my opinion.

My first motorized vehicle was a Honda ATC 90 I bought for $100 with money I earned pulling weeds all summer. Youhad to learn pretty quick not to put your leg down when tipping as the tire would get you.

It’s best to get clear of the bike when she’s going over.

Love these Sidi boots off road. Lots of protection, hard on bike plastic though. And not fun to tour in. A6D2C9BA-A84A-439D-94AB-30728389EFE7.jpeg
 

Mak10

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Aug 20, 2018
Messages
2,567
Location
SE Idaho
I bought some tool bags from Harbor Freight to organize things and keep them separated. One for food items and one for cook items. It has worked well for me. Easy to grab when packing and easy to unload. They are cheap, when on sale. The vibration and jigging about has worn holes. At $5 each they are great. I wouldn’t want to use expensive bags.

For water, I usually stop and buy a 1 gallon “arrowhead “ or similar plastic jug. They can wear out and develop small leaks too. Every grocery store has them and they are cheap. CA25832E-2702-4543-9914-D2B133A5935C.jpeg57994566-EEE2-41D0-A7A4-20F95A2AB977.jpeg
 

DamonS

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Joined
Apr 27, 2021
Messages
89
Location
Ontario, Canada
this is wonderful insight! .. thank you!
My last 2 week long adventure ride made me realize how much I hate panniers, but well i'm falling into the necessary evil camp... i'm now planning a journey across the country that will span a few months and kind of want the best of both worlds, so repacking and reorganizing each day bothers me. I want the best of both worlds really, where i can be lazy, drop my tent and camp kit and not have to worry about stuffing the dead space, for when I then want to grab a 12 pack of chicken and a box of fries for the evenings festivities. quite a few functionally awesome ideas that i'm going to err. borrow and try to implement...

i'm going to waffle about 100x, but this is my process and i'll probably incorporate it all because i can never decide. I literally want everything and i don't want to sacrifice anything to get it :D wouldn't you hate to have me as a customer?
 

DamonS

Active Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2021
Messages
89
Location
Ontario, Canada
I have hard boxes for riding on the road and usually on gravel. But I won't ride challenging gravel or real off road with them since meeting a RTW KLR owner who had the hard box break his lower leg in Mexico.

From the ADV thread on hard vs soft bags leading to broken legs:

[2Squirrely, post: 36531991, member: 337769]
It seems that people are treating the pannier = broken leg thing as a "myth." I feel strongly enough about this make my first post in years....

Three weeks ago I got a little too aggressive on a cold tire. I spun the rear tire on my VStrom exiting a parking lot on dry 35deg day. The bike fishtailed twice. I instinctively stood, and dabbed a foot to straighten out oscillation. My right pannier (a huge 1440 Pelican box) hit me in the right calf, pinned it to the asphalt, tore my leg apart and pulled the bike and I to the ground. I stood up right away to check on the bike. The leg wobbled when I stood on it and I almost fell over again. I also felt a terrible grinding feeling, so I sat to investigate. While I sat on my butt and held the knee upright, my foot fell over sideways independent of my knee!!!! So I straightened it and held in in place until the ambulance could come.

Results: a big spiral fractured plus a half-dozen other "butterfly fractures" of the Tib, and a cleanly broken Fib. ...ambulance ride, 5 hrs surgery, stainless steel plate, 20 screws, 40 stitches, and 8 weeks in a cast/crutches. Doc says I have good strong bones, but that they're no match for blunt-force-trauma that the pannier caused.

This all happened in a split second at 20mph on dry pavement. I'm experienced: 30+ year rider who's had dozens of bikes and raced moto, enduro, desert, etc. I commute 10-15000 mi/yr in all weather on the street. I was wearing good gear: Sidi Armada GTX boots and Aerostich Darien GTX pants over street cloths.

The myth is real. I didn't think it would happen to me... especially on an under-powered street bike, but it can and did. Soft panniers for me from now on. (And perhaps I'll grow-up a bit and save the aggressive stuff for the dirt... )

PS: the last pic is what "fracture blisters" look like. Apparently these paper-thin surface blood blisters form near severe fractures, and make an exciting little bonus surprise when your cast comes off at your follow-up visit. []

always in the back of my mind, i've spent a lifetime of GNCC, AMA ATVMX racing and hare scrambles, and am no stranger to literally dealing with the unexpected between my riders and myself. i no longer ride to the capacity i once did, thanks to easily 100 broken ribs, multiple broken toes, broken fingers, 3x femur snap, and a broken back in my racing career.. ATVs love to land on their wheels and chase you down like a rampaging rhino, so panniers back there are just like having 2 wheels of an ATV behind you, when i go down, i'm long separated from the bike thanks to a hyper sensitive flight response :D

My SuperT is going to live far from the dumb 'lets just try it and see' mentality, and spending an hour calculating the difficulty of a particular tough single track. I have dual sports if I want to be stupid, but i'm too damned old to pull a 700 pound motorcycle out of another mud hole with my support vehicle being a little crf250 with a kinetic recovery strap.
 

yen_powell

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Joined
Jun 19, 2018
Messages
257
Location
UK
Metal panniers, first picture is the right hand one one that survived, 2nd and third was the one on the opposite side. Contents were spread over a wide geographical area, the rider was sent to locate his cooker and kettle and make tea whilst the rest of us used rocks to hammer his pannier back into shape and tie it back together with ratchet straps. It was repaired in a local work shop but managed to self eject a few more times over the next few weeks, meaning no one wanted to ride behind him. His bash plate needed a bit of work as well, it was pushing hard against the clutch arm stopping it moving.tonysacc1.jpgtonyspannier.jpgtouratech1sm.jpg
 

DamonS

Active Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2021
Messages
89
Location
Ontario, Canada
hah. yen_powell, my experience with hard bags has been less than stellar.

I notice that few people ride with a hard side top box, and I think i know why.... mine is currently sitting somewhere in Northern Ontario in an undisclosed location (meaning I have no idea where) on the side of a railway line turned snowmobile trail, and the box was empty at the time.. it took the fibre reinforced ABS base plate with it leaving me with just my stock mounts. lesson learned, soft bag up top
 

VRODE

Easy Does It
Joined
Aug 7, 2014
Messages
940
Location
Northern Vermont
I have Tusk medium hard panniers mounted to SW-Motech quik release racks. This is my normal on-road setup. If I was doing any long off-road or BDR stuff, I have a set of Ortlieb waterproof panniers to slip over the racks as well. They are not the largest bags (I think 26L each) but they work for me. Used to be carried by Aerostich, but I think they're exclusive to Touratech now.
 
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