Hard starting and other problems

[2daMax]

I had mine died a couple of times while moving but with the clutch pulled in (only in Sports mode). Solved by TB sync and with the Reference Screw set out by 1/2 turn. Never had it died on me since.

 

[rushfan]

Swapped out the old battery for the new YTZ14S.. just look at the starter and it’s running.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[EdR]

Finished mod

I know this is a year or two after you did the mod, but I just got on this forum. Did the mod work for you?

 

[EdR]

New to the forum and at the suggestion of AVGeek I am posting this topic in this section.

I have been following a few stories of people who are having problems with no start, hard start, unstable idle and high rpm on startup. I too have been suffering these problems for over 1.5 years. My Yamaha dealer has spent a fair amount of time trying to fix the problems. They never came to a conclusion for the reason of the problems but replaced the throttle bodies which seemed to correct the problems but that ended up being only temporary before the problems returned. I decided to investigate the issues myself even though I have the extended warranty because I want to ride instead of waiting on the dealer to produce results. I believe I have found the cause and the bike is running better than it ever has. It has been trouble free for over 3000 miles and approximately 3 months. I will explain my story below and try to keep it brief.

My 2012 Tenere has suffered random no start, fluctuating idle, dying on upshift, and stuck throttle (3200rpm). I won’t go into the long history of how they developed. Suffice it to say that these were completely random with longer periods of persistency. After checking all the sensors and more, believe me, I felt the issues were connected to the controls on the throttle bodies. I had the gas tank hinged up, the air box off in order to watch the throttle action in various situations. Because my vision is poor I had to get my head between the tank and throttle bodies to see. As a result I braced myself off of the frame. When I put my hand on the wiring harness which is attached to the frame cross brace directly in front of the throttle bodies the engine died as if the ignition switch was turned off. With the engine stalled and the ignition still on I was able to lightly push on the wiring harness and rapidly actuate the throttles. However I was only able to repeat it six times before the throttles became steady. I thought there was a short. I took off the cover on the harness. It has a rubberized plastic cover taped over it with electrical tape. The wires looked physically new but I traced each one and produced no intermittent or open conditions. At this point I surmised it was electrical interference from the group of wires being too close to each other. There are six wires in the harness. I separated the front wheel speed sensor and the cooling fan leads into one group. The next group was the two ignition coil leads to number 1 cylinder, and the final group was the acceleration position sensor. I simply used 3/8 in. split wire covers you can get at the auto part stores and electrical tape. I have had absolutely no problems since. In fact the bike runs like new. This work explains the replacement of the throttle bodies being only temporary because you have to manipulate the wires connected to that harness while changing the throttle bodies. I believe that the no start condition is a result of interference to the acceleration position sensor which leaves the throttles closed during startup instead of positioned correctly for the sensor feedback to the ECU.

I do not know the physics of electrical current. I just know it worked for me. For all others on the forum who are having problems similar to this – if you have basic mechanical skills and can perform the above operation you have nothing to loose except 1 hour of your time and 5 dollars for some split wire cover. Probably less time than it would take to haul your bike to the dealer. I hope it works for you so you can ride more!

If you guys think some pictures would help I can try to post them. No guarantees because I am new to this forum stuff being the old fart I am.

Below I attached two photos. I cannot seem to get them in the text, but perhaps you will be able to open them.
The first photo shows the wires separated. I wrapped them in foil so you can spot them easily. The front pair with the boot contains a large tan lead for the front wheel speed sensor combined with a blue and black to the white coupler for the cooling fan.
The middle pair contains both leads to the number 1 cylinder coils. One is red with a black tracer, and the other is yellow with a green dot.
The back pair contains the leads to the acceleration position sensor. One is a large tan lead and the other is blue.
I am guessing that the tan sleeve is an attempt to shield those leads.
The second photo is the job completed with the split sleeve covering the leads.

Hope the photos help.
http://www.yamahasupertenere.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=17952.0;attach=33455;image
http://www.yamahasupertenere.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=17952.0;attach=33457;image

Mileageman, I am a recent purchaser of a 2013 ST and experienced the issues related to it recently. Been searching this forum for answers. Saw this fix and was encouraged that I might not need to replace the whole wiring harness. But in another thread it appeared that you have had the harness replaced. So did this fix end up not working? Thanks!

 

[jackintherok]

Apols for the length of this…

Post 23rd Dec 2017…Had the Gen 1 S10 from new since May 2012. Don’t want to bore you with the details, but have had like 50 or so hard starts (jump-started many times, push-started several times, and been trucked twice). Seems that the bile is sensitive to a combo of things like, cold, wet (especially overnight cold mist in the middle of nowhere), starting procedure, plugs (side stand side plug recess can fill with water), air filter, and throttle body crap build-up. And if she doesn’t start after 1 or 2 cranks she floods … and there’s no point in continuing the pain so, → F#4 out →crank (fires for 1 – 2 secs)→F#4 in → the WOT procedure →crank …and she fires most of the time. Right now, I’m thinking battery. New battery no problem, poor battery big problem, but intermediate battery … probably sensitive to all of the above. Over the last 5 years battery life has been less than expected (the 4th just fitted, the 3rd completely failed after 6 months). So, maybe she’s eating batteries. Maybe because after a 7-10 day layover between rides the battery is ‘tired’ and because relying on the generator to charge the battery cooks the buggar (AGM batteries are prone to hot spots at high charging amps, which is not good). So, much for the thoughts. Right now, am nursing a BS BTZ14S battery over the winter months, and will monitor its reducing performance.

Comment – the BS BTZ14S battery did not seem to be man enough to turn the engine when cold (overnight layover from 40 degs and lower). So, bought a battery tester in January.
Post April 1st 2018
My smart charger (Optimate 6) often told me batteries of 9 months or so old were A1, but I learnt the hard way they were not, especially, at temps < 40 F (when turnover was slow). Got a battery tester (Ancel BA101 only ~$45 not a bad investment, and its volts checked out against my multimeter). Even the new BS BTZ14S battery failed to start the bike at low temps (at 40 degs; Ancel said cranking volts fell to below 9.5v), but after warming the battery up to room temperature, she started powerfully (cranking volts 10.5). Seems that battery resistance as measured by this unit gives a better idea of battery status. Bought a lithium iron phos battery (EarthX ETX36C (definite overkill)) … more powerful all round, but the bike still suffers from a start issue at low temperatures (bike tends to die sometimes on first attempt after ~2 secs of running, but then starts immediately on the second with a strong petrol smell). It’s early days for the lithium battery, but so far (using WOT) it has not failed to start the bike from cold. It seems to power its way through problems. Seems there’s another problem of excessive fuel delivery during cold starts and a tendency for the bike to flood (reminds me of the old carb problems).
…. Fitted a Booster Plug in April to fix surging after deaccelerating with a cracked throttle at 2000-3000 rpm downhill. It didn’t do much for the surging, but it did improve starting.
Now with a cracked throttle (less than 1/2 inch) … not even a sign of a hard start no matter how cold, wet or misty it is.
What I learned for my Gen 1

1. Yamaha battery spec. (Yuasa 12S) is not demanding enough (they get ‘tired’ after less than 12 months) and other makes of batteries with similar specs are a no go for the S10.
2. Batteries don’t suddenly fail like light bulbs, they tire and can’t cope, and when they do battery chargers tell you they are OK, but for ‘tired’ batteries other little bike-related things that aren’t quite right become important and cause problems.
3. Batteries when knackered affect low rpm running (and when really knackered even affect higher rpm running) and can even make a bike stall.

 

[jbrown]

My 6 year old original battery and no hint of a hard start ever tells me that there is likely something more than the battery contributing to a hard start. I don't know what it is, but some bikes seem to be afflicted, while others aren't.

 

[jackintherok]

My 6 year old original battery and no hint of a hard start ever tells me that there is likely something more than the battery contributing to a hard start. I don't know what it is, but some bikes seem to be afflicted, while others aren't.

Have you had the problem from new? …. or tried a more powerful battery?

 

[jackintherok]

Have you had the problem from new? …. or tried a more powerful battery?

Forget the reply misread your post