Cam chain tensioner replacement

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#1
Replaced old CCT with 75000km (23P) looks similar.
The old tensioner has a different metal feel/color inside.it gives maybe a slight more spring but very little difference,hopefully it will see me for another 75000.
 

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blitz11

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#2
Replaced old CCT with 75000km (23P) looks similar.
The old tensioner has a different metal feel/color inside.it gives maybe a slight more spring but very little difference,hopefully it will see me for another 75000.
Nice. I am going to do my 25K service this weekend (if things go well), including a new cam chain and tensioner. It's nice to see that which with I will be dealing. Thanks.
 

Don in Lodi

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#5
Nice. I am going to do my 25K service this weekend (if things go well), including a new cam chain and tensioner. It's nice to see that which with I will be dealing. Thanks.
Why do you need a new chain?
 

blitz11

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#6
Why do you need a new chain?
I don't know if i NEED a new chain, but i'll have the valve cover off, maybe the cams out (depending on valve clearances), and to do this job right, from what i've read, you should have the clutch cover off, so I'm 95% of the way there anyway. i think that the new chain was $22, which is about $5 more than the clutch cover gasket, so i bought a new chain.

Maybe I am a masochist, but if i replace the chain now, and the cam chain tensioner is good, that's 25K more miles i'll be able to go before it needs to be replaced. Or maybe i'll be dead before i need it again.

I had a 750F honda (second generation) that used a hy-vo chain as its primary drive, and those chains would wear pretty quickly. A bit of preventative maintenance on my part, i guess.

It was the relatively low price of the chain which convinced me to do it.
 
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#7
Update : Just to let you know I’ve started the bike multiple times now,I don’t get that 2-3 second rattle.
Visually very little different between the tensioners but definitely big difference regarding engine start up.If your getting any rattling sound on start up and you’ve 50k+ Mileage I would recommend replacing it.
 
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#8
Why do you need a new chain?
The wear limit is 1/4 tooth on the camshaft sprockets. Chain, camshaft sprockets and crank are to be changed as a set. Some guys like to change just the chain. Not the smartest thing to do if the sprocket is worn. I personally would not recommend putting a new chain on worn sprockets. You are going to end up accelerating the wear on the new chain and already worn sprockets by doing this.

I my experience I do a few top ends with the same chain/sprocket set. Then when I split the cases I change everything as a set. It's how I have always done it and is what the service manual recommends. In reality you should not have to change any of those items during a routine service on the ST.
 

blitz11

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#9
The wear limit is 1/4 tooth on the camshaft sprockets. Chain, camshaft sprockets and crank are to be changed as a set. Some guys like to change just the chain. Not the smartest thing to do if the sprocket is worn. I personally would not recommend putting a new chain on worn sprockets. You are going to end up accelerating the wear on the new chain and already worn sprockets by doing this.

I my experience I do a few top ends with the same chain/sprocket set. Then when I split the cases I change everything as a set. It's how I have always done it and is what the service manual recommends. In reality you should not have to change any of those items during a routine service on the ST.
I don't HAVE to change it. I WANT to change it, and if the bike's apart anyway, for another $22, i have a new chain. With Hy-vo chains, it's the chains that wear, not the sprockets (and we've been through this before). When i was an engineer with GM Hydramatic, the 325, 125, 440 FWD transmissions (this was 36 years ago) all used Hy-vo chains. Chains took 97% of the wear, sprockets 3% (if that).

Hy-vo chains are NOT roller chains. What is true for roller chains is NOT true for Hy-vo chains. You really don't seem to understand that. Roller chain? Yes, change sprockets with the chain. Hy-vo chains? Completely different animal.

I probably change the timing belt on my 1992 volvo 740 too frequently, but after 27 years of ownership, i can do it pretty quickly. If i change the accessory belts, i throw a new timing belt in it, too. It takes an extra hour, and i know that it won't be an issue. 27 years and 300K miles later, the old girl is going strong. I can buy a continental timing belt for $8 from rock auto, so why not?
 

BWC

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#11
I also went ahead and replaced the timing chain when I changed out the 23P version Cam Chain Tensioner to the current 2BS model awhile back on my 12 at 80,000 km. The cam sprockets showed no wear, just a small amount of polishing of the teeth. Measuring the new/old chains there was a very small, but measurable amount of stretch/wear in the old chain. Although I would consider it a small enough amount of wear to be disregarded.
With the amount of work it takes to get at the CCT, chain and valves it is relatively easy to replace the chain while your in there, especially when the new chain costs a little less than a new air cleaner element and owners often replace them on a regular basis whether they really need it or not. Now saying that and what I previously found regarding chain wear on my 12 I won’t be changing the cam chain on my new to me 13 till much higher mileage, probably the 120-140,000 km range.
The real important parts replacement needed when doing a valve clearance check especially on the 12-13 models is upgrading the CCT to most current 2BS version.
 

eemsreno

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#12
My cam chain was shot at around 110,000.
I have a Graves manual CCT and the adjusting bolt was all the way in. I contribute premature wear to the junk stock CCT letting the chain flop around.
The sprockets looked new.
Now with around 75,000 on this chain I still have lots of the adjusting bolt sticking out of the Graves.
 

steve68steve

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#14
I was in the same position at around 30k miles and lazied out. I left the original chain in. I remember reading about changing chains and sprockets in sets and didn't want to go that deep.

I put a new Graves manual tensioner in when I buttoned it up. It took up about 60% of the adjustment. As I was turning the bolt around and around, I was kicking myself for not changing the chain... altho it's been another 20k miles since with and no noises or adjustments.
 
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#15
I was in the same position at around 30k miles and lazied out. I left the original chain in. I remember reading about changing chains and sprockets in sets and didn't want to go that deep.

I put a new Graves manual tensioner in when I buttoned it up. It took up about 60% of the adjustment. As I was turning the bolt around and around, I was kicking myself for not changing the chain... altho it's been another 20k miles since with and no noises or adjustments.
I would not sweat it at all Steve. As I stated earlier the chain/gears are to be changed as a set per factory requirement. It is extremely rare for just a timing chain to wear to the point of failure. Just like any other chain they have wear in. That's where you see the initial stretch. A lot of guys confuse that with a worn chain. They are immersed in oil so will show very little wear. Those manual adjusters have to be cranked in a lot even for a new bike. Had you put that adjuster on along with a chain, you would have adjusted it more than a few times already.

FWIW, I have no engineering background or accolades worth mentioning. I just take a common sense approach from years of practical experience.
 

blitz11

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#16
I eat crow.

My intention was to swap the chain, but all of the valves were exactly in the middle of their adjustment range, so I decided to wait until the time arises that i need to take the cams out to shim the valves. The new tensioner went in perfectly. My chain would rattle on startup only for the past 1K miles, so it was pretty early in the old tensioner's failure.

I had heard horror stories about the valve cover and its removal, but i had the forks off for seal, wiper, and bushing replacement. I left the forks off, and it gave me much better access to the valve cover - it was a pain to remove/install, but not a horror. FWIW.
 

Eleoho

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#17
Not sure if this is the right place to ask the question, but I just bought a 2012 S10 yesterday and the owner told me the Previous Owner had changed the automatic tension to a manual. How often does this need to be check and how do you go about it? Many thanks for any details that can be shared.
 
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