Burning oil ? Adding oil ?

Sierra1

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2016
Messages
14,812
Location
Joshua TX
My Tenere doesn't use oil, but the KLR I had did; at high rpms. The air box on the KLR was dry/clean, and the bike wasn't leaking on the ground, so I ASS umed that it had to be getting by the rings somehow. But there wasn't any residue/build up on the exhaust either. Since the bike ran fine, and DIDN"T use/burn oil at normal rpms, I just made sure there was oil in it and drove it like a rented mule. Never a hiccup with that bike.
 

WJBertrand

Ventura Highway
Joined
Jun 20, 2015
Messages
4,516
Location
Ventura, CA
I agree that it mostly is sucked back into the engine, and in that was is burned with fuel. But it's not leaking past the rings, which is typically what I think of when you say an engine is"burning oil".
There are a lot of ways to burn oil, all signs of wear or design issues. Oil getting past the rings directly is one way, the others include blowby aerosol, and valve guides and seals. The end result is oil burning, unless it's leaking, it has to be burning regardless of how it gets into the combustion chamber. Modern engines with catalysts often don't show much smoke though
 

PoconoRandy

New Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2018
Messages
22
Location
Pocono Mts, PA
I have been wondering about this myself, and am happy to see others with similar experience. My 2012 has 28,000 miles on it now, and I've had to top off the oil twice after seeing the oil light come on.

It normally burns 1/2 quart in 2-3k miles of sustained high speed (80-90 mph) commuting and burns little to no oil when enjoying (under 75 mph) the back roads and fire trails.
 

Tenman

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2013
Messages
2,102
Location
Natchez Ms USA
My gen 1 has 43000 miles and I add no oil between 5-6000 mile oil changes. I use whatever synthetic is on sale. I've never run it hard for over 80 miles at once.
 

2daMax

Active Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2015
Messages
675
Location
Penang, Malaysia
My 2012 has not seen many highway cruise speed but for one time touring, at a total of 1400 km, which has a few > 100 mph runs, I did notice a very slight drop in oil level. Was using a low cost fully syn oil, 10W40, Penzzoil Titanium Fastrack. At some point after the tour, I did open up the air box and notice traces of oil.

For most part of my usage on commuting, no loss of oil.

I agree that the oil is not lost via the rings but some gets trapped in the air box while some gets ingested back to the combustion chambers. I do see oily residue in the TB as evidence. I have helped service a friend's S10 that he regularly tries to hit past 200kph and found a lot of oil in the air box.

I believe at high speeds, the crankcase pressure is a lot greater to push out the oil mist to the air box. There is no resistance for the flow between the engine and air box. The air box, at high revs would be in vacuum (lower than atmospheric) and further encourages the pull of the hot gases from the engine.

For car engines, a PCV valve is employed to meter the ventilation. A stucked closed PCV often results in breaking the engine gaskets due to high pressure build up inside the engine. Some employs a oil catch can to prevent the oil from returning back via the TB. There was a case of a S10 with a kinked oil return hose that resulted in blown engine gaskets.

I have also been thinking of designing a 'PCV' device so that the condensated oil can return back the same way it came from but fearing that the pressure build up in the engine may cause more trouble than it's worth. Some ideas are like the distillation process where a long winding path for the gas flow to go through and as it cools along the path, it condensates back into liquid and flows down due to gravity. There is no pressure restriction and would be safe.
 

Don in Lodi

Well-Known Member
Founding Member
2012 Site Supporter
2013 Site Supporter
2014 Site Supporter
Joined
Feb 1, 2011
Messages
5,780
Location
Lodi Kalifornia
A couple weeks ago I made a run out to Yellowstone. Three days of sustained high speed, added 3/4 quart in Jackson Hole. Three days coming home, different route, high speeds but more varied, no consumption. Interesting, but not really concerning. You aught to Google oil consumption in the automotive world. Honda considers a quart every thousand or two to be 'normal'. Have Hyundais come in very low as well. Replaced a motor a couple years ago.
 

Cycledude

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2016
Messages
3,998
Location
Rib lake wi
Friend had a Goldwing that he had bought brandnew and it used a little oil, he claimed that was because he ran it so hard. Years later he bought another brandnew Goldwing and ran it just as hard as the first one but it never used any oil.
 

WJBertrand

Ventura Highway
Joined
Jun 20, 2015
Messages
4,516
Location
Ventura, CA
It's kind of hit or miss with oil consumption. My current fleet of vehicles (Super Tenere, 2013 Mustang GT and 2011 Rav4) don't seem to use any oil between changes. Previous motorcycles I owned that did use oil were a '78 XS750E Yamaha right from new and two rebuilds later the dealer couldn't fix it and my 1993 Honda ST1300. I also had an '84 Toyota pickup that burned oil. Both the ST11 and the truck got worse as miles accumulated. I ran K&N air filter in both of them over many, many miles. In both cases grit in the oil film on the clean side of the filter convinced me to put OEM filters back in. For the Toyota putting in an OEM filter also unexpectedly solved a poor fuel mileage issue I'd been chasing. I don't know if the K&Ns contributed to the oil use issue or not but I lost confidence in them after that.
 
Last edited:

eemsreno

Well-Known Member
Founding Member
2011 Site Supporter
2012 Site Supporter
2013 Site Supporter
2014 Site Supporter
Joined
Nov 25, 2010
Messages
3,227
Location
On your way to everywhere, , Iowa
When I'm traveling and need to stop in at a shop to get a qt of oil for the old girl, I just say to the parts man, "Stinking KLR" of course I don't ride a KLR but I blame them anyway for starting the trend.
 

~TABASCO~

RIDE ON ADV is what I do !
Founding Member
2011 Site Supporter
2012 Site Supporter
2013 Site Supporter
2014 Site Supporter
Vendor
Joined
Apr 4, 2011
Messages
7,328
Location
TEXAS
When I'm traveling and need to stop in at a shop to get a qt of oil for the old girl, I just say to the parts man, "Stinking KLR" of course I don't ride a KLR but I blame them anyway for starting the trend.

LOL..... Bawahahahaaahahahhahahaaaaa
 

Den

Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2015
Messages
68
Location
Istanbul
Picked up my 2012 in May 2016 and didn't really have any issues except for the occasional warning light for 1 mile in the mornings. I primarily use the ST for touring with wife, including the occasional trip in town. Last year we did 3 weeks all across Greece and the light came on 2/3 through the trip. Greece has a lot of mountains (80% in fact!) and the light would stay on while riding up them. Towards the end of the trip the light stayed on while riding flat surfaces so I topped up oil a little and had no issues.

More recently we rode down to the Med coast fully loaded and the light came on again and stayed on. I had the bike serviced at 30000kms and took it in to the shop at 36000 to check the oil. Despite adding about 2-300ml during our trip turns out the bike was down by roughly 1 litre :eek:

They use Yamalube fully synth 15-50 and I tend not to ride the ST too hard as it's fully loaded most of the time. I do ride like a dick when I'm solo but I don't mistreat her in any way.

So this is quite a bummer as we were planning on riding to India & back next year, maybe I'll start looking for a replacement as the guys at the shop said they'd need to check compression first, then start on open heart surgery if required :(
 

Den

Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2015
Messages
68
Location
Istanbul
Although I do recall two very spirited rides lasting roughly 3 and 5 hours each, so maybe I haven't been as easy going as I thought
 

EricV

Riding, farkling, riding...
2011 Site Supporter
2012 Site Supporter
2013 Site Supporter
2014 Site Supporter
Joined
May 22, 2011
Messages
8,227
Location
Tupelo, MS
Picked up my 2012 in May 2016 and didn't really have any issues except for the occasional warning light for 1 mile in the mornings. <snip>
Normal.
More recently we rode down to the Med coast fully loaded and the light came on again and stayed on. I had the bike serviced at 30000kms and took it in to the shop at 36000 to check the oil. Despite adding about 2-300ml during our trip turns out the bike was down by roughly 1 litre :eek:
Not seeing the problem. Did you correctly check the oil level before you left? As per the owner's manual? Most people glance at the sight glass before they leave and think that's enough. It's not.

High rpm use will use some oil. 36kkms is nothing to this motor. I put 83k miles on my 2012 and it only used oil under high rpm riding.

They use Yamalube fully synth 15-50 and I tend not to ride the ST too hard as it's fully loaded most of the time. I do ride like a dick when I'm solo but I don't mistreat her in any way.

So this is quite a bummer as we were planning on riding to India & back next year, maybe I'll start looking for a replacement as the guys at the shop said they'd need to check compression first, then start on open heart surgery if required :(
I would be hugely surprised if you have low compression at that low mileage. You haven't even done the second major service. Don't forget to replace the CCT before your trip.
 

Don in Lodi

Well-Known Member
Founding Member
2012 Site Supporter
2013 Site Supporter
2014 Site Supporter
Joined
Feb 1, 2011
Messages
5,780
Location
Lodi Kalifornia
Den, you did read the rest of the thread, right? I get the picture that oil consumption under some conditions can be considered normal. Not a trip ending event. If you have several days of high sustained speed travel, just know you're going to need to top off. Like my experience a couple weeks ago, three 6hr days at 80 mph needed 3/4 quart. Then three 6hr days of varied speeds didn't need a top off. I get the feeling that some European roads have a very high limit. 65-70 mph for months and no loss, three days at 80 and a top off needed. Can be a pain, but forewarned is forearmed.
 
Last edited:

dcstrom

Well-Known Member
Founding Member
2011 Site Supporter
Joined
Dec 16, 2010
Messages
2,035
My 2012 with 150,000 miles burns hardly any more oil than new. My routine is, change oil with the correct volume, ride till the oil is low in the sight glass, about 3000 miles (about what you saw in yours Tabasco), put half a litre in it, ride till the oil is low again, then change. So my changes generally are 6-7000 miles. That's generally how it works out, unless I'm running a lot of high speed, in which case it burns a bit more.
 

~TABASCO~

RIDE ON ADV is what I do !
Founding Member
2011 Site Supporter
2012 Site Supporter
2013 Site Supporter
2014 Site Supporter
Vendor
Joined
Apr 4, 2011
Messages
7,328
Location
TEXAS
Sounds just like mine. Seems to be ‘normal’

Safe travels!
 

Don in Lodi

Well-Known Member
Founding Member
2012 Site Supporter
2013 Site Supporter
2014 Site Supporter
Joined
Feb 1, 2011
Messages
5,780
Location
Lodi Kalifornia
My 2012 with 150,000 miles burns hardly any more oil than new. My routine is, change oil with the correct volume, ride till the oil is low in the sight glass, about 3000 miles (about what you saw in yours Tabasco), put half a litre in it, ride till the oil is low again, then change. So my changes generally are 6-7000 miles. That's generally how it works out, unless I'm running a lot of high speed, in which case it burns a bit more.
Trevor!!
 

Pdrhound

Active Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2017
Messages
335
Location
High desert
My '12 has 35000 miles. Both times over the last 2 oil changes it needed oil at about 4k miles. Both times i added about a cup to get the light off and bring the level just into the sight window. I changed the oil almost immediately (100 miles) basically i add 3.75 qts at oil change with filter to get window 3/4 full. I add the 1/4 qt to get through to change the oil when the light comes on.

Using acetevo semi 20/50 in summer and 10/40 in winter. 20/50 really smooths out the clutch on the hot days.
 
R

RonH

Guest
Unless a quart every 600 miles, I don't worry. Mine never uses oil, but I've had oil burners in the past. Kawasaki considered 600 miles to a quart within spec for a new motorcycle in the 80s. You won't see smoke even at 300 miles to a quart for the most part. These cars you see once in a while smoking to high heaven must be burning a quart every 100 miles or less.
 
Top