Break-In oil age VS mileage - Not the typical oil question

[Hfjeff]

I bought my2016 ES a couple of weeks ago with 220 miles on it. It was originally registered in July 2016 so it was 14 months old when I got it. I now have 450 miles on it and am not sure I will get to the 600 mile mark before the weather turns and I put it away for winter. I am sure it still has the break-in oil in, so it has been in there over 1 year. Questions:

1. Is the break in oil a special oil designed to seat the rings and valves?
2. Is it important to run the break-in oil a full 600 miles before changing?
3. Would it be better to change the break-in oil out at 450-500 miles after 1 year, or leave it until I hit 600 miles, even if that isn't until spring?

My intuition says I should change it before winter even if I do not hit the 600 mile mark. But I also don't want to NOT fully break in the motor/transmission before I change out this "special" oil.

We are supposed to warm up a bit next week so I am thinking I will get some more ride time in. My normal commute is 1 hour at 80mph on the interstate and I really don't want to make that higher RPM trip until I get some new oil in so I am trying to do some easy Saturday/Sunday riding to get me to the 600 mile mark.

 

[EricV]

Re: Break-In oil age VS mileage - Not the normal oil question

I honestly don't know if Yamaha uses any 'break in oil' like some manufacturers do. Most of the oem 'break in oils' are just strait weight non-synthetic oil. Nothing exotic. I've had three new Yamahas since 2003 and the oem oil appeared to be normal oil. I changed the oil on two of those bikes at about 35 miles after doing a moto man break in procedure. It's a personal choice, break in method, but this works well for me. Google it for more info. I put 109k on my first Super Ten and it was doing very well in terms of bottom end and cylinders. At 82k miles I had a CCT failure and warranty repair. They replaced the pistons, but told me the cylinders looked excellent and some of the original cross hatching was still visible w/o any significant signs of wear.

I would suggest you do a Moto man break in and change the oil and filter before putting the bike up for the winter. Even if you choose not to do the Moto man break in, do change the oil and filter before putting it up. It's not so much the oil breaking down as residual water content and acids in the oil that do damage when the bike sits for the winter. Changing the oil and filter, tossing some Stabil in a full tank of gas and taking it for a short spin just prior to putting it up for the winter is always a Good Idea.™

You might also consider stuffing a rag in your airbox intake to prevent any mouse nests, along with some strategic placement of moth balls. (Just make sure to tape a note to the speedo about removing these before firing the bike up in the spring.)

Remember, the 600 miles is not gospel. And the owner's manul says no sustained high rpms, not no high rpms, during the 600 mile break in period. It's ok to run it up there, just don't hang out at high rpms for long periods. Hard to avoid constant rpms during commute... but then again, 3rd gear will go 80 mph too... ::26::

 

[2daMax]

I am with Eric on Motoman hard break-in but at 450miles, most of the ring seating opportunity may be lost. But as they say, the S10 takes 8k miles to fully break-in, so never hurt to do a Motoman and then go change the oil and filter. My 1st oil change was at 100km after motoman method. Place in mineral oil and use it for abt 1200km. I have experience very little oil lost over a 1400km journey with frequent high speed and I believe this to be due to the motoman method. Rest of my S10 buddies in my country often complains of oil loss after a high speed journey, often needing a liter to top up between oil changes.

You may consider putting in magnetic drain plugs (2X) and these trap all ferrous metal debris. I've seen the amount of trappings and am really glad I used these magnets. There are still lots of debris even at 14k km.

 

[OldRider]

I've bought my last three bikes from a dealer 120 miles away and I would ride them straight home and change the oil. It has always been very dirty.

 

[Checkswrecks]

As EricV mentioned, oil accumulates acid so change the oil without worrying about the 600 mile interval.

The acid is created from combustion by-products mixing with normal air humidity at each start. Once the oil starts to become acidic, then the calendar is as important as miles.

 

[magic]

Hfjeff, I know it's mid October, but there will be some good riding weather coming. You shouldn't have any trouble putting on some more miles. Then do your oil change and put her away for the winter. Change the oil and filter, fill it up with gas add some stabilizer, keep the battery charged and it will be ready next spring. I see some mid 60s in next weeks forecast. ::021::

 

[markjenn]

I'm with the others..... there is nothing magic about the factory-fill oil nor any need to get to 600 miles before changing. Getting year-old dirty oil out of the crankcase before storage overrides everything else.

- Mark

 

[WJBertrand]

These days I think the term "break in oil" just refers to whatever the original fill was. I don't think many if any manufacturers use anything special or different than the normal oil recommended for regular maintenance.

 

[EricV]

These days I think the term "break in oil" just refers to whatever the original fill was. I don't think many if any manufacturers use anything special or different than the normal oil recommended for regular maintenance.

I tend to agree with that. BMW still claims to use 'break in oil', but no one, including the master, factory trained, BMW techs, could tell me what it actually was. :question: They were pretty adamant about leaving it in for the 600 miles though, which I found amusing.

 

[Cycledude]

::021:: yes it would be nice if you change the oil before winter but heck it really won’t have any measurable effect on anything if you wait until you have exactly 600 miles on it next spring.

 

[Sierra1]

I'm not sure about motorcycles, but I KNOW that cars MUST use break-in oil for a new build. I THINK it has extra zinc? I've seen several people try to shortcut the break-in with regular/cheaper oil, and ruin their motors. But, I never keep oil in an engine more than a year; regardless of mileage. Of course Hfjeff COULD do 70m.p.h. until he reached the 600mi mark. ::025:: Two birds....one stone. ::001::

 

[bob dirt]

Lots of opinions and no facts about "break in oil". My opinion is to change it before storage.
This has nothing to do with your question, but my motor home has a Mercedes Diesel engine and the service manual says to wait until there are 20,000 miles(yes, twenty thousand) before the first oil change. No, I couldn't wait that long...

 

[markjenn]

I've seen several people try to shortcut the break-in with regular/cheaper oil, and ruin their motors.

I'd like to hear one, just one, first-hand bonafide report of someone "ruining" their motor by doing an early oil change.

The few times people have done oil analysis of factory-fill oil they've reported it appears to be exactly like regular off-the-shelf oil but sometimes has a higher moly content. This is probably explained by the use of assembly lubes during motor assembly. In any event, 98% of break in is over at 50 miles, so changing it 450 vs. 600 isn't going to make a whit of difference.

- Mark

 

[Hfjeff]

Thanks guys. Picked up oil and filter and will get it done tomorrow. I probably have few days left but at this time of the year the weather is unpredictable and before you know it the cover is on and it is parked in the corner of the garage until March.

 

[WJBertrand]

I'd like to hear one, just one, first-hand bonafide report of someone "ruining" their motor by doing an early oil change.
- Mark

Me too, I don’t buy it...



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[Sierra1]

I'd like to hear one, just one, first-hand bonafide report of someone "ruining" their motor by doing an early oil change.

No, not an early change, wrong oil. Newly built CAR engines can be ruined by using the wrong break-in oil due to CAR break-in oil having different additives. That is my question, are bike engines THAT different from car engines. To me, they're both internal combustion, but I'm just a monkey on a bike. And because of my lack of knowledge, I tend to defer to somebody that I am SURE is knowledgeable. I KNOW that Yamaha knows what they're talking about, so I follow the manual exactly. Opinions can/will differ. ::001::

 

[EricV]

No, not an early change, wrong oil. Newly built CAR engines can be ruined by using the wrong break-in oil due to CAR break-in oil having different additives. That is my question, are bike engines THAT different from car engines. To me, they're both internal combustion, but I'm just a monkey on a bike. And because of my lack of knowledge, I tend to defer to somebody that I am SURE is knowledgeable. I KNOW that Yamaha knows what they're talking about, so I follow the manual exactly. Opinions can/will differ. ::001::

Actually, it would be better if you formed your own opinions based upon your actual experience instead of believing what Yamaha says is good for them is good for you. And find where it says you shouldn't change the oil before 600 miles. It only specs that as the first interval. Nothing says, IIRC, that it's bad to change it before then. O

 

[Dogdaze]

I believe bike manufacturer require a 'max' period of 600 miles / 1000kms, as EricV stated, they really don't want you running more than the 600 miles.

 

[ace50]

Ya, I did mine at 500! Glad I did after seeing the condition of it! ???

 

[Sierra1]

I believe bike manufacturer require a 'max' period of 600 miles / 1000kms, as EricV stated, they really don't want you running more than the 600 miles.

I kinda thought that's close to what I was sayin'. Maybe I need to articulate better. I just believe there is a difference between the oil in the bike when you buy it and the oil that goes in at first change. I also believe that it needs to stay in the motor long enough to do what it's supposed to. I also believe there is a built in "fudge factor" with everything. Anywhere between 500 & 700 miles would likely be fine.